OH NO! California wants to ban gas powered vehicles

[sansouci]

Cali is going crazy. Newsom wants to ban the sale of gas powered cars in favor of EVs by 2035. I may still be alive then so in addition to hoarding parts, I may have to hoard gas if this idea spreads to the East coast.
To think that some of the wild fires were started by mismanagement of the electric grid in Cali and the increased demand on the grid with all the EVs, it will be a total nightmare. No gas, no trees, collector cars under glass (in my garage). The ultimate doomsday.
Ken

[olympia57]

I did read that there was considerable power outages due to the over reliance on wind/solar /magic power generation after the State veered away from real world petrochem / nuclear stations in the last couple of decades ?

[dmac156]

That announcement is for NEW cars. By 2035, I doubt very many manufacturers will be making any cars that run on fossil fuels. Existing cars, and classic cars will still be bought, sold and driven.

[brickwhite]

"going crazy"???

They call it the land of the Fruits and Nuts for a reason.

[GRNSHRK]

Hey, I resemble that remark

But it's true that it affects the potential sale of new vehicles in 2035, but we will be able to keep our beloved 6ers on the road

But since this issue is really global, I really wonder how much effect this ban will have

[brickwhite]

It will affect your power grid...

[nick88highline]

It will affect your power grid...

You're not wrong there. The UK Government wants to move the target to 2030, ie no petrol or diesel cars to be sold after that. I would assume the sale of petrol and diesel fuel will continue for many decades after this date, but who knows?
I have an electric car, but given that around 2.5 million new vehicles are registered in the UK every year (not this year of course) and they were all to be charged (assuming they were BMW i3s like mine), by just 50%, we'd need something in the order or 20GW of power, which is five times the output of the largest power station in the UK, Drax and almost two thirds the total countrywide demand. More modern EVs with bigger batteries would need considerably more power than that. Where is it to come from?

[chicane]

But it's true that it affects the potential sale of new vehicles in 2035, but we will be able to keep our beloved 6ers on the road

For how long? And that phrase; "we will be able to keep", as if they have a right to our property.
There are going to be ICEV long after we kick. This applies to new cars SOLD IN THE STATE. All of the new car dealers will just move right across the state line in Oregon, Nevada and Arizona and sell Californians new ICEV cars.

Why anyone would want to live in that hole is beyond me.

[sixseries]

Probably cuz they like great weather, awesome outdoors, making tons of money, and the most dynamic economy in the United States. But beyond that, yeah I have no idea

[Pod]

So what will they do when the fire trucks dealing with the incessant wildfires have to return to base for 12 hours at a time to recharge their batteries ..............

[sansouci]

So what will they do when the fire trucks dealing with the incessant wildfires have to return to base for 12 hours at a time to recharge their batteries ..............

That's diesel anyway

[sansouci]

So what will they do when the fire trucks dealing with the incessant wildfires have to return to base for 12 hours at a time to recharge their batteries ..............

They will likely be slower to ban diesel
As to gasoline, with declining petrol powered cars, gas stations will close and the price of fuel will rise.

[sixseries]

I mean I would hope that Pod was just being facetious. Even if they do ban gas powered vehicles, it would likely be new cars only, and they would make obvious exceptions

I actually think fuel prices will drop initially in this scenario, as the demand will decline while supply remains likely stable. Then fuel prices will increase again as supply is cut. But I would also think gas taxes would increase

[sansouci]

With declining fuel tax to maintain roads (unless rates rise) will they tax electricity or impose an annual vehicle fee to offset this? Seems to me that a tire tax makes sense as wear and tire life are mostly correlated to miles driven. But this is a 2030-2050 time frame problem.

[Russm21]

As a kid growing up in LA in the 70's, I remember how bad the air was. When I would come home from playing with my buddies (when the street lights came on), my eyes would burn and my lungs would hurt from all the smog. I still live in LA and my kids have no idea what that was like because of regulation and technology, and I'm grateful for that. SoCal still has a long way to go with our air quality issues. However we have come a long way as well. Which leads me too...

Fuck the Prius and the people who drive them. Let me explain. Like the rest of you, I love cars, especially beautiful classics. Unfortunately, we are a very small minority. Most people think of cars in a strictly utilitarian manner. It's a way of getting from point A to point B. No sense of style, not paying attention to the road, no concern for impeding the flow of traffic or any love of driving. Basically a Prius driver. SO, since most people don't give a damn about driving then let them drive electric cars. It's better for us and our children.

The cars we love aren't going away. But the cars that don't matter are. I'm definitely not a tree hugger. However, clean air is better than dirty air.

[86_6series]

Russm21,

+1, In 1970 I was in LA from NY and the smog was bad--burning eyes
and throat irritation. The gov't has cleaned it up. Just as NY cleaned up the
lower Hudson River. As long as they don't ban old cars or tax gasoline $100.00 a gallon,
I'm with you. Let them drive those pregnant roller skates to clean up our air and we'll
take full advantage of driving fun cars at their expense.

[sansouci]

It is interesting to note that some of the first cars were electric. Jay Leno has an early electric, a 1908 Baker. There is also a French car museum in Florida with early electrics. It's the Tampa Bay Automobile Museum in Pinellas Park with a 1922 Milburn Electric and a 1971 CGE Gregoire Electric. Back to the future.
I still can't figure out how the power companies in Cali will augment their transmission system to handle the nighttime load without burning down the state (again!)
Ken

[sixseries]

My best guess is fire resistant transmission, like underground transmission wires, but that would be absurdly expensive also. Your best guess is as good as mine but I think wildfires is the main issue California will be facing going forward

Other ideas:
Massive storage (also extremely expensive)
Massive forest culling


I kinda think targeted electrical blackouts are the best policy. Sucks for certain people though

[sansouci]

If you have rolling blackouts, there may then be greater reliance on daytime solar charging or solar battery storage that then charges the vehicle.

[RossDinan6]

I kinda think targeted electrical blackouts are the best policy. Sucks for certain people though

Are you serious? Just randomly shutting off the power is no solution. A band Aid at best.

[sixseries]

It’s not random at all. It’s obviously only during high winds in high risk areas, and those events are generally pretty predictable. And I imagine they will just get smarter and more targeted with continued investment in the transmission infrastructure

[RossDinan6]

Still, the power is shut off by the supplier. I am paying for electricity and expect it to be available. Occasional outages are to be expected due to storms etc. I sure as hell know this living in FL. CA power outages are due to decades of mismanagement. no other reason.

Now they want to force battery cars without enough capacity to keep the lights on when the wind blows despite their wind generation. It would be funny if it were not so sad.

[Jlc]

With declining fuel tax to maintain roads (unless rates rise) will they tax electricity or impose an annual vehicle fee to offset this? Seems to me that a tire tax makes sense as wear and tire life are mostly correlated to miles driven. But this is a 2030-2050 time frame problem.

My guess is by then our cars will be collecting so much data that the state will simply make the manufacturers provide mileage data and sen you the bill when yo renew your tag; or simply require the new OBDC spec to report mileage and require an annual mileage check instead of emissions; or your electronic plate will have a GPS to record and report miles driven