1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Moderators: GRNSHRK, ron, bfons
1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
A customer at the bmw shop I work at gave me his 633csi yesterday! It no longer has any emissions stuff and very low on power . It has a ripped intake boot and didn’t run at all until I taped it . A new one is in the mail . Anyway how do you guys get through emissions? I live in Colorado and they are pretty strict.
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
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- Platinum Member
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- Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2004 3:24 pm
- Location: Gilroy (SF Bay Area) CA
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Welcome to the madness, now how cool is that
Regarding getting through emissions testing in CO, meh, try CA
There are several members from CO on the board, tshultz and hefeweisen come to mind, might want to PM directly for info, pretty sure both have series I (early) cars and Tom has an '80 Euro as well, surely "fun" to get tested
Once again, welcome
Regarding getting through emissions testing in CO, meh, try CA
There are several members from CO on the board, tshultz and hefeweisen come to mind, might want to PM directly for info, pretty sure both have series I (early) cars and Tom has an '80 Euro as well, surely "fun" to get tested
Once again, welcome
Bobbo
1980 633 CSi Cypress Green/Pearl Beige
2017 X5 M Sport Xdrive 35i Carbon Black/Ivory White
2005 330 Ci ZHP Cabrio Imola Red/Bone/Black
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Congrats on the acquisition. New Mexico is emissions friendly, just saying. Even in Abq, over 35 years old is the golden number for emissions exempt. Check to see what year your cylinder head is, the one I just replaced was a 79' and it was cracked.
Karmann, German for extra rusty.
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
It has a spare head in the trunk so maybe it’s been replaced or maybe it needs to be replaced haha . I was thinking about just welding flanges for a removable cat or cats but I feel like it would destroy a cat pretty fast . I haven’t even attempted to get it though. Think the people who work there know what the air injection and reactors look like . I have those also in the trunk . How bad is it to bolt them on once every two years . How do they even work ? Thanks for any help !
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
So is it 1983/84 or is it an earlier car.
I don't have experience with air injection but with a cat a the engine tuned up close you should be fine. Easiest would be to get a wideband gauge and see what it's doing after you get it running OK.
For emissions if it is running well and you have a CAT you should be fine. The problem is running lean and getting a reading of high NOx to fail.
I really appreciated this post:
viewtopic.php?t=19661
I don't have experience with air injection but with a cat a the engine tuned up close you should be fine. Easiest would be to get a wideband gauge and see what it's doing after you get it running OK.
For emissions if it is running well and you have a CAT you should be fine. The problem is running lean and getting a reading of high NOx to fail.
I really appreciated this post:
viewtopic.php?t=19661
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
It is a 79 that had reactors instead of cats . I do still have them how do Thermal reactors work ? Can I just bolt them on temporarily? Without doing a bunch of plumbing? Thank you for the link that was helpful .
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Before '82 I think, you only need to pass the two idle test here in Denver, so you may actually be able to pass if you show up with a warmed up engine... Worth the $20 to try I'd say.
I saved this from my dad's E3 which had the same system:
and another schedmatic: https://www.bmw2002faq.com/applications ... 268e737c34
I haven't messed with one so I don't exactly know how it works, but it looks like it takes exhaust gasses and pushes them back through the engine after they go through some sort of filter. It seems the air pump also somehow reduces the concentration of exhaust gasses by adding heat...
It is well known that these systems caused so much heat that cylinder heads were cracked and a lof of these systems were removed from the engines.
I saved this from my dad's E3 which had the same system:
and another schedmatic: https://www.bmw2002faq.com/applications ... 268e737c34
I haven't messed with one so I don't exactly know how it works, but it looks like it takes exhaust gasses and pushes them back through the engine after they go through some sort of filter. It seems the air pump also somehow reduces the concentration of exhaust gasses by adding heat...
It is well known that these systems caused so much heat that cylinder heads were cracked and a lof of these systems were removed from the engines.
Air injection tubes in each exhaust port to cause the exhaust gases to get HOTTER!
EGR dumps nasty carbon building krapp into your intake track - really fouling up the intake ports, Intake valves, and causes very poor running when the system is sick
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Yes I am going to try tomorrow. I am just praying the the people working there don’t know enough to tell that All that stuff is gone .
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
- zinnocoupe
- Posts: 506
- Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2014 12:57 am
- Location: Vancouver BC
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
I just removed al the egr crap from my 77 e12. It seems to be an unbelievably complicate and primitive system. I doubt I would be able to replace it all correctly and make it work again if I had to in order to pass emissions. I think the way it works is the belt driven air pump that resides above the alt, pumps air in to the the front of the exhaust manifold then the oxygen makes the exhaust gases completely burn all the nasty hydrocarbons up and spews clean( haha) air. The exhaust manifolds get extremely hot and in my cars case the tar heat shield material has actually turned molten and flowed down the side of the inner fender . Its a hardened black goo mess all along the frame rail. I've all also picked up a set of E12 M535i exhaust manifolds and downpipes to replace the dreaded thermal reactors. I'll be interested to hear how you do at the emission testers. I'll bet they have no idea what the egr/thermal reactor system should look like. Although they may wonder where the cat is. Good luck
- Hefeweizen
- Posts: 2324
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- Location: Colorado Springs
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Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Sorry but I live in Colorado Springs where we don't have that requirement. Tom got all the points covered and unfortunately, I have nothing to add but the usual stuff like: New spark plugs, filter, oil change maybe?
Rainer
03 330Xi (DD)
85 635CSi (RIP 3 May 19)
80 633CSi (Red Euro, Project)
"If you think a good European mechanic is expensive, try a bad one!"
03 330Xi (DD)
85 635CSi (RIP 3 May 19)
80 633CSi (Red Euro, Project)
"If you think a good European mechanic is expensive, try a bad one!"
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
If I'm not mistaken, your car will qualify for the 'Collectors' license plate here in Colorado. You should be able to take it to one of the few remaining emissions stations for older cars and have it tested. These guys are few and far between, but generally very workable, wink-wink, as far as obtaining a passing emissions test. ($) If you do pass, your plates are good for five years and you generally will never need to have another test. Toph
1983 633CSi Balticblau Metallic
1972 K5 Blazer w/4Wheel Popup
1972 Datsun 510 Badass Monster!
1959 Corvette FI 283
1950 8N Ford Tractor (Harrison)
"Strive for perfection, excellence will be accepted."
1972 K5 Blazer w/4Wheel Popup
1972 Datsun 510 Badass Monster!
1959 Corvette FI 283
1950 8N Ford Tractor (Harrison)
"Strive for perfection, excellence will be accepted."
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Do you know of any of these classic car emissions shops in the Denver area . A quick google search didn’t show me any.
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
https://www.emissions.org/colorado-emis ... locations/
You can try any of these, on the phone first, to explain your issue. Maybe see if you can get a helpful and positive response. Toph
You can try any of these, on the phone first, to explain your issue. Maybe see if you can get a helpful and positive response. Toph
1983 633CSi Balticblau Metallic
1972 K5 Blazer w/4Wheel Popup
1972 Datsun 510 Badass Monster!
1959 Corvette FI 283
1950 8N Ford Tractor (Harrison)
"Strive for perfection, excellence will be accepted."
1972 K5 Blazer w/4Wheel Popup
1972 Datsun 510 Badass Monster!
1959 Corvette FI 283
1950 8N Ford Tractor (Harrison)
"Strive for perfection, excellence will be accepted."
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
I'd be interested to hear what you find out about this subject :)
'76-'82 are the only years that you have to worry about here, so only a select few of us have to worry about it.
'76-'82 are the only years that you have to worry about here, so only a select few of us have to worry about it.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
So I went to emmissions today and failed visual because after ten minutes of looking they couldn’t tell how the air injection system worked . Mine has been deleted. I just played stupid and he said if I could show him the how it worked he would pass me for that . I’m sure I could have easily made something up like it’s in the head and here is he hoses that feed it. So I have to make something look remotely like air injection. I also failed being 4x over on hc and a bit over on co . Idle was the worst. At 2500 rpm I was only over by 20% on hc and less for co . Some issues the car has are the fan clutch is stuck so it never warms up completely that doesn’t help I’m sure . I am going to smoke test it tomorrow to be 100% sure there is no vacuum leaks . I hear there is a way to adjust fuel trim at idle ? I will try that also after I fix the fan and any leaks . I was thinking about welding a Bolt in catalytic converter That goes in place of the resonator just for a emissions. Unless Someone knows of a direct Bolt in . At that point I think it will be pretty close if not passing . And I will of spent enough money to apply for the waiver. I got temp tags today and the lady there told me if I spend $715 at a shop which I work at lol , I can Be exempt from emissions for one cycle Which is five years for collectors plates. She also said that they really don’t check mileage which was the one thing keeping me from applying for collectors plates. You’re supposed to only drive 4500 miles a year.
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
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- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3728
- Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2004 3:24 pm
- Location: Gilroy (SF Bay Area) CA
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Sheesh, maybe CA ain't so bad after all
I'm far from stock appearance under the hood as well, but they never even bother with that BS
OK, upper left hand corner in the attached photo shows you where the idle mixture screw is
Please note that this view is upside down
Good luck, ya know, adding a cat permanently might not be all that bad of an idea after all
I'm far from stock appearance under the hood as well, but they never even bother with that BS
OK, upper left hand corner in the attached photo shows you where the idle mixture screw is
Please note that this view is upside down
Good luck, ya know, adding a cat permanently might not be all that bad of an idea after all
- Attachments
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- afm adjustment.jpeg (56.5 KiB) Viewed 12713 times
Bobbo
1980 633 CSi Cypress Green/Pearl Beige
2017 X5 M Sport Xdrive 35i Carbon Black/Ivory White
2005 330 Ci ZHP Cabrio Imola Red/Bone/Black
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Wow. EPA driven authoritarianism gone mad It's a near 40 YO car !!
1986 635csi LOCUTUS / Arktis Blau Metallic / Pearl Beige / S38B36/ Close ratio dogleg 5sp
2002 E46 M3 / Topaz Blau Metallic / Black Nappa / 6 speed SMG software tuned / Bilstein PSS10 Coilovers / CMP RACP reinforcement
2002 E46 M3 / Topaz Blau Metallic / Black Nappa / 6 speed SMG software tuned / Bilstein PSS10 Coilovers / CMP RACP reinforcement
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
I am just afraid the the car will destroy a cat because it runs rich all the time . Does the idle mixture screw turn that wheel or are they separate adjustments ?
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Separate. The idle adjustment screw is only for idle. Tighter for richer I believe, loosen for more lean.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Thank you !
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
So I got it to pass today just by putting on the old thermal reactors, and using a electric air pump from a z3 at the junkyard. I ran a hose to the air injector rail and wired the air pump to key on power . The whole project was 50 dollars or so and took about an hour and a half to install the reactors and run the air pump wiring plumbing ect. Thank you for all your help . I am excited to start driving this thing more ! It needs a manual transmission.
1979 bmw 633 csi
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
1992 Subaru Legacy turbo
1996 Subaru Impreza Rally car
Rally America #727
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- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3320
- Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 9:28 pm
- Location: scottsdale, arizona
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Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Nice thing about AZ is if you can show them you have classic car insurance and the car is over 25 years old, you don't need smog. Also if you get into another county other than where the PHX Valley is located, no smog. My car is put back to full euro specs, so since my brother in law is building a home in one of those counties, one way or another I will escape smog.
81 Euro 635 M90 with motronic. Currently under a complete nut and bolt restoration. Pictures at
flickr.com/photos/bertsphotos.
flickr.com/photos/bertsphotos.
- zinnocoupe
- Posts: 506
- Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2014 12:57 am
- Location: Vancouver BC
Re: 1979 633csi emissions without thermal reactors
Wow amazing, congrats on passing. Will you remove the thermal reactors and replace with normal exhaust manifolds now? Or leave it. Please post pics of your free car!