Identifying Getrag trans

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Radical Racing
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Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Radical Racing »

I purchased a disassembled E24 parts car mainly for the sport seats. The seller said it was an '85 with a Getrag 265 5 speed transmission and 175K miles. The trans was in the trunk. I cannot find any stamping or embossing on it that says 265. GETRAG is embossed on the passenger side of the case and following on the drivers side. 2620051090 225 1.3 Can some one please tell me what model Getrag transmission this is and details from this information? Thank you.
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by baders »

The 265/5 actually has 262 stamped on the side. Post some pictures and we'll soon tell.
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by baders »

Here's a good picture;

Image
1986 635csi LOCUTUS / Arktis Blau Metallic / Pearl Beige / S38B36/ Close ratio dogleg 5sp
2002 E46 M3 / Topaz Blau Metallic / Black Nappa / 6 speed SMG software tuned / Bilstein PSS10 Coilovers / CMP RACP reinforcement
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Brucey
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

for some reason 265 transmissions say '262' on the side. 265/5 and 265/6 are the commonest 5s transmissions in older E24s. Both have detachable bellhousings. They are different lengths to one another and there are differences in the external castings, as well has having a different shift pattern.

If the gearbox has not got a detachable bellhousing then it will be a 260 if was originally attached to a M30 engine and a 280 if it was originally attached to an M88 or S38 engine.

This chart may be helpful.
Image

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Brucey
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

also

Image

what they call 265 is 265/6 and what they call 262 CR is 265/5, I think. The diff ratios varied by market, eg in Europe the 265/6 transmission was supplied with a 3,07 diff.

The easiest way to discriminate between 265/6 and 265/5 CR transmission is that on the back of the gearbox, at the 11 o'clock position, there are three hollow protrusions on 265/5. These are absent in the 265/6 transmission.

Image

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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Pod »

Very useful, Brucey. Thanks!
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randall977
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by randall977 »

This is very relevant to me as I'm in the process of replacing my damaged 265/5 CR - thanks for posting.

I had considered a 265/6 as I'm not really into racing and I'd rather have an autobahn cruiser. I decided not to go with the 265/6 as I think I would need a new driveshaft - Is this correct? I've taken my drive shaft off a few times and it can be adjusted - but not enough I assume?
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

randall977 wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:55 pm This is very relevant to me as I'm in the process of replacing my damaged 265/5 CR - thanks for posting.

I had considered a 265/6 as I'm not really into racing and I'd rather have an autobahn cruiser. I decided not to go with the 265/6 as I think I would need a new driveshaft - Is this correct? I've taken my drive shaft off a few times and it can be adjusted - but not enough I assume?
the propshaft lengths are in the ETK. They also vary with the diff that is fitted. I would definitely choose the gearbox I wanted and then buy/modify a propshaft to suit if needs be, rather than buy a gearbox to suit my propshaft; that seems a bit bonkers to me...

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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by randall977 »

Just been looking at the ETK and it seems that the 265/5 (sports Gearbox) and 265/6 both use the same driveshaft. The support is different but not that difficult to obtain...
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by jps635 »

Brucey, any chance you can post those pages as a pdf?

Thanks
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by randall977 »

How much less does a 265/6 cost than a 265/5 CR? Half?
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

jps635 wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:53 pm Brucey, any chance you can post those pages as a pdf?

Thanks
will this do?
see http://web.archive.org/web/200512240010 ... 0/pg49.htm

pages 49-57 inclusive contain a lot of useful information. Obviously they are trying to sell their gearboxes there (which are a marked improvement over stock) but that aside there is enough information to allow a rational choice of standard gearbox to be made.

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Brucey
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

randall977 wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:10 pm How much less does a 265/6 cost than a 265/5 CR? Half?
It is less for gearboxes in known good condition but a 265/6 is still a sought-after transmission; it has a detachable bellhousing and it is strong enough to sit behind Aston Martin V8s, old jag E-types and so forth.

If you want an inexpensive OD transmission, use a later model 260, which has similar ratios to 265/6 . Some of these have the motronic sensor mounts on them. You can differentiate the early 260 gearbox (which is not very strong) from the later model 260 (which is better but still not as strong as a 265/6) by the finning on the gearbox sump.

This is a late model 260
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BMW-E34-E32- ... Sw8UZaBeH6
it lacks the motronic sensor mounts but it might be possible to machine the bellhousing to accept the sensors. Price is pretty typical for this gearbox, and ones with the mounts are about the same money. Worth checking with some of the BMW dismantlers to see what they have to offer.

BTW I would not assume that any used 265 was in GWO unless proven to be so; 265/5 has synchros that wear (and wear fast if you are daft enough to use a GL5 oil) and the layshaft is not very well supported; the nature of the beast is that it is both likely to driven hard/badly and it is prone to wear. A used 265/6 is a better bet because it is stronger and is not the kind of gearbox that gets thrashed so much. Even so you are talking about a gearbox that is 35 years old; anything could have happened to it in that time.

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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by jps635 »

Thanks Brucey. Useful info.
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by wattsmonkey »

I could be wrong here, but I always thought the 262 number on the casting was because the front part of the case is the exact-same part from the 262 four speed box. The 265/5 and 265/6 have the additional centre section to make them a five-speed.

From my (direct) experience of both the above, the boxes are directly interchangeable: shifter, prop, mounts and guibo.

I've got the dogleg in my 635 and had the 265/6 in my burgundy 635, plus two more 265/6s over the past twelve years. They are noisier and baulkier than the 260 unless Redline MT90 is used, although this does seep past the seals more than straight GL4.

In fact, I think I preferred my 265 to the 280 in my M. How's that for heresy?!

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Brucey
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by Brucey »

wattsmonkey wrote: Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:28 pm I could be wrong here, but I always thought the 262 number on the casting was because the front part of the case is the exact-same part from the 262 four speed box.
I think that is right, it is what I've assumed too.
From my (direct) experience of both the above, the boxes are directly interchangeable: shifter, prop, mounts and guibo
.

I thought there was a slight length difference between 265/5 and 265/6 but maybe I'm wrong, or this is lost in the noise.

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randall977
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by randall977 »

I was looking at the drive shafts listed on the ETK and it appeared to show just one length for the 265/5 and 265/6 but different support brackets. When I looked at the support brackets in more detail it seems that my 265/5 is on a 265/6 support bracket (cast alloy)...so maybe I'm not looking at things correctly...? There can't be much difference between the two boxes and the drive shafts can be adjusted by maybe 25mm+
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Re: Identifying Getrag trans

Post by wattsmonkey »

I remember getting into the detail of this ages ago, I think the medium case diff fitted to the 1982/3 635 uses a 10mm longer prop because the diff is physically shorter than the large case fitted after the 1983 changeover. However,the scrapper I bought with a 265/6 and medium case diff had the "wrong" later prop fitted as a replacement (part sticker still on it) with no ill effect. The 10mm is lost in the sliding joint. Apologies if that makes no sense whatsoever, I'm still high on burned sealant having chopped off an e24 wheel arch in a spare hour this evening!

I'm going on my experience of e28-based 6ers here, not the s1 cars.
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