My '83 633CSI Engine Rebuild/Repair thread

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AlphaShark

My '83 633CSI Engine Rebuild/Repair thread

Post by AlphaShark »

I started this thread over on bimmerfest however I feel I might get better input here. I'll first start with the history of my e24, I have owned my shark for over 3 years now and in that time have spent countless hours researching and repairing my 633CSI (countless issues where solved by forum posts here). She is not the cleanest or nicest shark in the ocean but she is mine. The car has been running strong, however I need to replace the rear main seal and fix some electrical issues. Because I plan on owning my shark for many more years and use her as my daily driver I have decided to rebuild the m30B32 (260k miles). This is the story of my 633CSI.

A few months after obtaining my E24 one of the clutch pressure plate supports snapped at about 5k rpm chewing up the inside of the bell housing(results below), at the time I was still not familiar with the car and regrettably after hours of work replacing the clutch I did not fix or even check the rear main seal, little did I know it got chewed up due to the vibrations from the clutch Causing it to leak a quart of oil a month. The transmission in this car is the 260/5 so I would need to replace the transmission to fix the bell housing witch I'm reluctant to do because it shifts perfectly.

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Never really seen anything like this...

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The damage is the worst here.

As I am a college student money is going to important things so replacing the dash with a new one from BMW for 700$ is out of the question for now. because of the major splitting in the dash I decided to fill the cracks and repaint it to make it a bit less noticeable until I can afford a new dash (might get a parts car for the interior). I sanded down the edges of the cracks and filled them with ridged foam sanded again then painted the result was much better than the original (however I feel like a silicone rubber sealant would have worked better). Replace the fuel pump and filter at this point.

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Car after the dash is removed, so meany wires.

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Dash before sanding and filling cracks

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Dash after sanding and filling cracks

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Dash painted and installed.

About 2 years into owning my shark I had a sudden and very pronounced loss of power, the car would only rev to 3k rpm and was very limited in power. After allot of searching and going through the electrical and mechanical systems the 20 year old custom cat back exhaust comes off, after driving it with open headers I concluded the cat was clogged. Reluctant to replace the cat I ran some pressurized water through the exhaust to see if there where anything large blocking the entrance or exit to the cat (this fixed the problem). I was surprised how much junk came out of that cat, Eventually it will be replaced however it passed emissions even with all the 80's emission junk removed.

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Oil from the leaking rear main collected on the cat

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Full exhaust, Love the sound I get from this.

A few weeks after this I decided to hunt my idle issue (my idle wasn’t that bad just surged from 750-1000 every once and a while), after a while of hunting I found the TPS (throttle position sensor) connector had the idle lead completely separated from the solder joint this was repaired and fixed the issue completely. I also replaced some other possible failure points at this time including cap and rotor, oxygen sensor, and crank position sensors. During this process I pulled both the lower and upper radiator hoses and the radiator make room to replace the fan clutch, when reinstalling the lower hose I did not check the clearance to the water pump pulley (something I will now do).. After driving it about a mile the belt ripped a hole the size of my thumb in the hose luckily the local auto parts store was just a few feet away and they had the replacement hose I needed!

One MAJOR mistake I made was using the wrong o ring on the fuel pressure regulator, the one I used came from a o ring set I had laying around(I assumed it was a standard Fuel injector o ring). The o ring held for the first few weeks but about a month after replacing the fuel pressure regulator and the o ring it started to spray gas on the intake manifold (I was luckily my car didn’t go up in flames).

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The o ring on the left is the one that leaked, the right is the correct o ring.

This brings me to the current project, rebuilding the amazing M30B32 powering my Shark. Before getting ready to remove the engine and transmission I took it to a car wash and sprayed down the engine and what I could reach on the transmission, they where both covered in oil from the rear main seal leek. This turned out to be a big issue. After this the car would not idle without me playing with the gas, after finally getting it back home (this was quite a challenge) I discovered that the oxygen sensor was shorting on the exhaust (I think this caused the idle problem but not sure). After removing the hood, ac compressor, alternator, radiator and labeling my wires the only thing left was removing the transmission bolts… Wish I would have known they where 2 different sized bolts because I ended of stripping every single m8 bolt using the M-10 Torx socket when putting them back on the first time I replaced the clutch. After hammering on M-7 Torx socket to remove the reaming bolts the engine was lifted out. The engine was stripped down and the head was sent to the machine shop to get rebuilt. Cleaning the pistons wasn’t hard I wasn’t expecting flat faced pistons (I should have knowing how low the compression is), there was a fair bit of carbon buildup but not bad for 260k miles After removing and marking all the pistons the crankshaft was inspected, unexpectedly the number 2 journal had some pits in it possibly from a previous rebuild It has been turned and I will just use oversize bearings. Last piece of headache for me caused by the vibrations of the old broken clutch, the shifter support cracked luckily a replacement was sourced from Bavarian auto!

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Got the hood off and wiring out of the way, Lets get it out!

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Number 3 all cleaned up, Number 4 not so much.

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The bushing was in similar shape.

I measured the piston clearance and the roundness of the cylinders, the piston skirts are warn badly and all the cylinders are out of round. So new pistons and a bore is necessary. Ultrasound showed that the walls where 8mm thick just enough to go to 92.5mm however after reading some other threads on boring out that much material I have decided to go with .5mm over sized m30b32 pistons.

cylinder 1: Clearance = 0.0030 inches
cylinder 2: Clearance = 0.0018 inches
cylinder 3: Clearance = 0.0032 inches
cylinder 4: Clearance = 0.0031 inches
cylinder 5: Clearance = 0.0035 inches
cylinder 6: Clearance = 0.0035 inches
Note tolerance is between 0.0008-0.0020 inches.

Info that may be helpful regarding the m30b32 and m30b34:
Both the M30b32 and m30b3have the exact same; crank, connecting rods, and heads (note the heads are somewhat different using 2 springs per valve on the b34 and a different cam however the bare heads share the same part numbers)


New parts that have been delivered or that are shipping now:
new timing sprocket, chain tensioner and guide (not replacing the sprocket on the crank)
full gasket set
Drilled disks and new pads(The road I drive tends to overheat my breaks and warp them)
Shifter support, and mounting hardware
Oxygen sensor, oil pump and water pump
standard rod and main bearings (can't use these now anyone interested?)
connecting rods and bolts
MaxSil .5mm over pistons


Now this brings me to a few concerns I have now. The first concerns the head bolts, are these the reusable kind or do I need to replace these?

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I was getting some odd loss of power issues (stereo would lose power lights would flicker) for the last 2 months my shark was driving and the voltage regulator failed the in car test, After replacing the voltage regulator and taking just the Alternator in for another test the alternator failed results below, Should I replace now or try in the car and replace later (I'm not sure they tested it correctly)?

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Third issue I have is my sun roof is leaning forward on the driver side any idea what could cause this? Its the electric sunroof I assume its to do with the tilt mechanism.

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Excuse the paint she has been sitting for a month.

More to come soon as my parts come in. 8)
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JCS
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Post by JCS »

Alpha,


Welcome, I look froward to following your progress.


Best,
Jay
'88 M6, Red/Tan
My NEW Website https://www.jaysbmwparts.com/
AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

Ok after educating myself over some special features of my shark I found out she has a single mass flywheel, the same one on the e28 m5. I previously thought she had a dual mass... Now this brings me to my question I get the rattling/clattering when I shut the engine off (something that is common with the dual mass) what could cause this, could my rotating assembly be way off balance?
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Re: My '83 633CSI Engine Rebuild/Repair thread

Post by hornhospital »

AlphaShark wrote: Now this brings me to a few concerns I have now. The first concerns the head bolts, are these the reusable kind or do I need to replace these?

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From the Pelican Parts website:

"Rebuilding your engine? Why take risks with old hardware? Use OEM original bolts when reassembling your engine. Head bolts have a tendency to stretch when they are initially torqued, so it's good insurance to use new bolts during re-assembly."

At $3 each, it's cheap insurance for the original hex head bolts.
Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

Ok quick update. New head bolts alternator and other miscellaneous parts ordered. Oil pump was put on back order...

I was planning on painting the block silver, anyone have other color suggestions?

Here are the pictures of number 2 journal pitting and baring. :(
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Ozibimmer
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Post by Ozibimmer »

Hi There
Can you post a few pictures of your car and also what product did you use to repair dash cracks please.
Regards
Addam
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Post by e24trapt »

I hope that "exhaust" doesn't get used....great way to choke an engine....probably the back pressure the exhaust created fucked your main bearings....maybe have an actual tech take a look
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AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

Can you post a few pictures of your car and also what product did you use to repair dash cracks please.
I'll Post some pictures this weekend. I used Great stuff foam insulation on the dash then painted the dash with vinyl paint however the effect only lasted about a year until the cracks spread, if I was to do it again I would use silicone rubber sealant to keep them from spreading.

I hope that "exhaust" doesn't get used....great way to choke an engine....probably the back pressure the exhaust created fucked your main bearings....maybe have an actual tech take a look
As for the exhaust its 2.5 inches and was built by a reputable shop back in the 80's and it will continue to be used until I have the funds for new headers (it flows more than stock). The pitting and wear on the baring was most likely caused by the tight cylinder to wall clearance in number 2 as well as previous issues the car had. (you can see that even after 260k miles it is 12 thousands smaller than the rest and the only cylinder still in tolerance) The rest of the bearings were basically new with moderate ware on the thrust bearing. But thanks for your concern. #-o
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Post by GripGreg »

Welcome!
Do you have a book? If you had one you would've known to replace the rear engine oil seal, I believe.

Get a book!!

Ask here about the best one. I think it's the Chilton Manual.
Glad to see you're hands on.
Good luck,,,,Greg
Ps,,As Ken said, definitely replace your head bolts & don't jump in w/o asking here.
These old Bimmers are trickier than you think & these guys want to help!!

Did I say get a book?
Hit the apex
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Post by hornhospital »

Chilton and haynes are OK, but the Bentley E28 manual is the one you really need. The post-mid '82 E24s are based on the E28 chassis and share engine packages and suspensions.
Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

Do you have a book?
I have the Bentley E28 manual and the Chilton Manual as well as a host of PDF's that have been linked on the forums here. At the time I did the clutch I knew little about BMW's also at the time I didn't have a backup car and getting to school was important so the clutch was a rush job (that I'm paying for now). however over the last 2 and a half years I have learned quite allot, and grown an enormous respect for the e24 and m30 engine.
Thanks for the input and interest in the build! :wink:
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Re: My '83 633CSI Engine Rebuild/Repair thread

Post by Alpinacsi »

hornhospital wrote:
From the Pelican Parts website:

"Rebuilding your engine? Why take risks with old hardware? Use OEM original bolts when reassembling your engine. Head bolts have a tendency to stretch when they are initially torqued, so it's good insurance to use new bolts during re-assembly."

At $3 each, it's cheap insurance for the original hex head bolts.
That is a very generic quote. The rest of the quote that has been omitted does not even deal with our m30 type motors and talks about bolts used on other BMW motor designs. The m20 uses torque to yield bolts that should be replaced but the ones for the m30 are reusable one cleaned and inspected.
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Post by AlphaShark »

m30 are reusable one cleaned and inspected
Well considering I'm rebuilding the engine with all new parts now I might as well replace them for only 50 USD. Ill measure the length of the new bolts against the old ones to see if they have stretched out over time.

these are very strong Class 10.9 bolts... Equivalent to the grade 8 used in aircraft..
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Post by Alpinacsi »

AlphaShark wrote:
these are very strong Class 10.9 bolts... Equivalent to the grade 8 used in aircraft..
How's that? I would like to see that classification/comparison.
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Post by AlphaShark »

How's that? I would like to see that classification/comparison.
link
As you can see grade 8 and class 10.9 have the same strength. AN and Chromoly bolts are a bit stronger and I know ARP use Chromoly for a roughly 30% stronger bolt than class 10.9 however they are substantially more expensive.
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Post by Alpinacsi »

I am sorry it was late and I was thinking something else. You are correct. I was thinking SHCS which is rated higher than grade 8. Still have to be careful comparing stretch with new bolts due to the age and/or change of mfg. i guess you could compare the lot and check for inconsistencies. I have been working with these since back in the mid 80s and always reused the head bolts except on race engines. Reused them once then or went to studs. The replacement ones are cheaper than the factory replacements but I would want to know where they are coming from.
Alpina B9 coupe (Alpinweiss)
Alpina B9 sedan (Alpinweiss)
Alpina B6 clone in process (Alpinweiss)
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AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

Ok time for some pictures, she isn't the nicest shark in the shark in the ocean but she is mine.
Eventually I plan on redoing the interior and repainting her henna red All the clear coat is gone, she is pealing and has been badly repainted in areas :(

Still needs to be cleaned up a bit, sound shielding has been removed because it was basically goo.
Heat shield will be reinstalled after being cleaned and painted.
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Notice the bullet hole in the hood? PO stated it was a rod/tool that he slammed the hood on....
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Looks like something with a bit more velocity to me..
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The antenna is missing some teeth.. wanna swap to a Z4 antenna at some point.
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The Trunk of parts.
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US Bumpers I cant wait to get rid of these..
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My temporary new wheel....
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Old Sports wheel its pealing and getting sticky allot.. looking for a brand new Sports wheel, or i might just go Mtech 2...
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A bit nose high without an engine. Most of the pealing is on this door as well. :(
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If you want any pictures of particular points or questions or comments feel free to leave them below.
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Post by bunty635 »

is your exhaust single pipe all the way, if it is i'd say get the original twin pipe set up from the boneyard. that'll solve gas flow issues.
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Post by Brucey »

someone shot your car!

I found this pic on the web

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and some of those holes look very similar.

good luck with the refurb!

cheers
~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

someone shot your car!
While the hood was up too!:shock:
is your exhaust single pipe all the way, if it is i'd say get the original twin pipe set up from the boneyard. that'll solve gas flow issues.
Alright lets get into this.
The exhaust was clogged from the 25 year old cat falling apart I have ordered a new one and will be replacing this shortly.
Now lets discuss the difference between dual 1.5 and the 2.5 inch system on my car.

For a 10 inch length of tubing 2.5 inches in diameter
49.10714285714281 inch square internal area

For a single 10 inch length of 1.5 inch tubing
17.678571428571413 inch square internal area

For 2 10 inch lengths of tubing 1.5 inches in diameter
35.35714285714282 inch square internal area

As you can see in a 10 inch length of tubing there is more area for gases to be at any one given time therefore there will be a lower total pressure.
Now we could also go into the way the gases flow and how the single system is much more efficient than the dual system because of the resistance the walls of the piping place on the gas.
As well as the resistance that the muffler puts on the stock system although small my system is straight back no muffler.
Oddly enough the restricting point of my system is the stock down pipes. :roll:
Length matched down pipes would be the way to go(If only I was made of money).
AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

New oil Pump and pistons came in today as well as some other things that Ill show when I get a chance to install.

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I noticed the high pressure relief valve seems to be lacking from the old pump I'm now kind of worried.. Is the new one just a higher pressure pump that was used on the newer m30b34 and b35 it should work just fine right?(I don't have the block to match it up to) Its still the bolt on gear type that I assume uses shims.
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Delivered the pistons to the machine shop going to recondition the rods and get the bore of the cylinders done soon.
Image
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Post by Brucey »

I think that some pumps should be matched only with some oil filter housings so that there is at least one pressure relief valve in the system with enough capacity.

If you have a relief valve in both then I can't see that it should do any real harm, but if you have neither, or just one with an inadequate capacity, it'll cause trouble.

I believe that this aspect of the M30 did give some trouble and was therefore revised as time went on.

The oil pump drive chain has a tensioner fitted on later engines IIRC.

cheers
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Post by LandShark »

Do you need a cat? Why not a "test pipe" or straight pipe? How stringent are the emissions laws in ABQ? Are classics exempt? I plan on moving there soon...
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AlphaShark

Post by AlphaShark »

LandShark wrote:Do you need a cat? Why not a "test pipe" or straight pipe? How stringent are the emissions laws in ABQ? Are classics exempt? I plan on moving there soon...
All cars after 1974 have to pass emissions testing they use the badge number for the displacement so you get some wiggle room because the engines on these cars have a lower displacement then the badge suggests. My car barely passed the last check so that's why I'm replacing the 20 year old cat. If your close to the limit on the emissions testing you will only get a one year registration on the car and if you pass with flying colors you will get a 2 year for these old cars. These rules only apply in the Bernalillo County which includes all of ABQ if your outside of Bernalillo you don't need emission testing.
Hope it helps.
Chris Wright

Post by Chris Wright »

AlphaShark wrote:New oil Pump and pistons came in today as well as some other things that Ill show when I get a chance to install.

I noticed the high pressure relief valve seems to be lacking from the old pump I'm now kind of worried.. Is the new one just a higher pressure pump that was used on the newer m30b34 and b35 it should work just fine right?(I don't have the block to match it up to) Its still the bolt on gear type that I assume uses shims.
Image
Brucey went through something similar some time ago and this is what he found:
viewtopic.php?t=8594&

In the past there has been some misunderstandings of the various relief valves, so this is my understanding of the oil pump and its relief valves:

The oil flows from the pick-up through the pump then back out to a relief valve (the one with the visible spring**) with regulates the pressure to a max of 112psi (8bar) before going to the oil filter so as not to cause any leaks in the filter assy.

The oil filter has an internal by-pass valve that is closed during low pressure (Idle) and the oil flows through the filter. As the pressure rises the filter becomes too restrictive and the filter by-pass valve opens to allow sufficient oil pressure to rise in the engine. During normal running, a great deal of the oil by-passes the filter. This valve does not regulate the engine oil pressure.

The max engine oil pressure (58 / 87 psi. - 4 to 6 bar) is regulated by a pressure relief valve** included as part of the front of the oil pump body but I don't believe it has any oil galleries or other connections to the pump its self. If you look at the new pump in the photo below, you can see at the pump end that there is an oil port in the casting directly above the pressure relief valve (just below the top, front mounting bolt hole), with I suspect goes to the main oil galley to regulate the pressure. Perhaps AlphaShark could take a look and confirm this?

**See the link above for the locations of the relief valves.
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