633CSi Turbo - Not a Callaway or an E24 Anymore

Document your Sixer project here.

Moderators: GRNSHRK, ron, bfons

User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Worry no more, as the guys at my exhaust place got it cleaned up! I actually would have preferred they make the tips a good 3-4" longer and have them be very close to flush with the rear bumper, but oh well. I won't lose any sleep over it.

A couple of photos.

No more low hanging exhaust. I thought they could bring it up more, but this should be sufficient with how stiff the springs are.

Image

From the rear:
Image

A couple of small details that I may not have conveyed lately:

1. I went back to a standard oil inlet fitting (1/8" NPT x #4 AN). No restrictor.

2. Right now my blowoff valve does vent to atmosphere. This causes a rich condition after shifts, and the car will occasionally die. Considering changing this in the upcoming weeks. Any thoughts on the importance of this? I would be plumbing the air back into the system post-AFM and pre-turbo.

3. I have the valve cover breather venting to atmosphere with a "breather vent." Basically it won't allow small objects in or out, just air and vapors. Do I really need to plumb this back into the intake system (before the AFM) or is it acceptable to leave venting to atmosphere?

4. I am currently running with FQS switch at position #2 which is -3.9% fuel. I have not yet determined if this adjusts the fuel map through the range or simply everything but idle and/or WOT.

5. I have disconnected my WOT wire on the TPS. It was causing everything to go too rich when the throttle was fully pressed.

6. Fueling goes more rich in colder temperatures. I imagine this is the case with the standard system, but maybe it is exaggerated a bit more due to my larger injectors. I have further testing to do in warm weather, but like that my FQS switch will allow me to both add and remove fuel with the simple rotation of the knob. I still need to determine if this is a reasonable setting to change based on air temperatures. Maybe on hot does I effectively add fuel, and on very cold temps I might consider removing fuel.

7. With my current setup I am not using O2 feedback in any fashion. I have a terminal sitting there so I can connect and disconnect for testing purposes, but my current fuel method is not using O2. This leaves the O2 sensor in place but disconnected, and my Wideband sensor in place giving me digital AFR readouts.

8. The current wastegate is a non-name TIAL knockoff. The spring setting is 7 psi. No boost controller yet, but I have looked into them. First, I plan to bump the spring up to 11psi and tune fueling if required. The new TCD turbo seems to spool up about the same amount as the old Rotomaster. Overall power at 7psi isn't much less than the Rotomaster at 11psi. Good to know that I haven't really sacrificed anything with the new turbo. Also, the SS hardware had no problem coming apart.
I am hoping this power bump will allow me to keep up with stock E36 M3's on the track. They have the altitude loss of NA power, where FI doesn't lose quite as much.

9. The rear strut bar didn't fit perfectly. I had to elongate the holes slightly so that they would line up with the holes of my chassis. Not sure if this is due to the accident history of my car or the Mason Engineering Strut bar. Hopefully I won't have this problem with the front one. Regardless, the idea is that both are more tied together than before.

10. I have the AC compressor in place but haven't charged the system and may not end up doing so. The heater box is messed up in terms of flapper vents. I should have fixed them when I was in there, but I didn't. I also haven't installed the AC belt yet. Lastly, I don't know where to get R-12 and haven't really cared now that the windows work and I don't have an exhaust leak.[/quote]
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

I registered for a track day in april and have been aiming to get everything ready for that day. It will be interesting to see how the changes I have made affect drivign dynamics and approximate lap times. As I mentioned before, I hope for the car to be on par with E36 M3's. They have a similar weight and likely similar power figure I'd imagine.

I spent probably about 9 hours this week taking apart the front end of the car and replacing the suspension components now that the exhaust was brought up and in.

I had done this before on my 535i is separate steps where I would either do shocks/springs only, or control arms only. I knew it would take some time to do it all so I started early.

I didn't take a lot of pictures as I was super greasy from the amount of old, caked on grease and dirt on the car. Upper and lower control arms were a difficult proposition because the sway bar was in the way/ I didn't want to take it off as I recall it being a tight fit and difficult to install. Luckily an adjustable wrench got me enough onto the nuts to take them off.

The control arms looked totally shot, with visible cracks all the way through the bushing. The ball joints seemed OK all in all. I had a new set of standard control arms, so I don't have the Meyle HD arms on there, but I figure it's a place to start.
Then I removed the front struts, which was relatively easy considering I have done it probably 5 times prior with my e28's. I had all the tools I needed and got the struts out. interestingly, they had a different 'gland nut' holding in the shocks than I had seen in the past. This led me to believe they were original (9/82) to the car. Luckily not rusted in place, but a nice 18" pipe wrench helped me take them off. The bump stops were destroyed, along with the dust covers.
The old shocks did not absorb anything or rebound at all. Prior, I was basically riding on front springs only! '

The new Bilstein sport shocks slid right in, and I got everything reinstalled with my old Eibach springs that used to be on my 535i. I had liked how they performed for me on my 535i at the race track in the past, and they were much better than a progressive coil like the H&R's.

I finally got everything back into place, and then pre-loaded the new suspension bits. I think my alignment is now off, and I have some excess toe-out but I will look at this later in the week. I may or may not get it aligned just yet. Since everything is new, it is easy to adjust, and I can get real close by eyeballing it on the ground and then driving it and rechecking it.

The sway bar adjustable links (from Ireland Engineering) were one of the last items to install. Unfortunately I found that one was cross-threaded by the previous owner. I hope to get it cleaned up or even remade at my work this week.
Also, the O2 sensor was cross threaded in the exhaust :roll: I need to call the shop and see if they could fix it monday. I want a new sensor and/or bung if it is messed up! I didn't loosen it and haven't touched it so that I don't have to pay a cent.

On to the pictures! I think it looks good all in all :)

Image

Image

Image

Image

You certainly notice the et20 wheels and the arches sticking out. The BBS RS's or these 32's with 12mm spacers would fit very well, I imagine!


Is this really the same car as page 1? :shock:

Image

Image


Initial impressions: Well, there is no front sway bar hooked up currently, so the car has a little worse turn-in response than before. But overall, it rides very well over the bumps (with no sway bar, hah) and seems like it should work well.
The Z3 shift lever sits a little lower than i wanted, but after driving, it is pretty nice in terms of throw. I might still go for E36 Euro M3 lever, just so that the longer lever length reduces the force required to shift into each gear. But overall, it was easy to get used to. A good upgrade to really eliminate a lot of the normal throw of the g265.

The recirculation of the bov has helped a lot! The car no longer wants to stumble after shifts, and feels a lot more smooth with this modification. I imagine with my plumbing, that the vacuum of the turbo helps to pull any pressure from the intake tract when the throttle is closed. I feel a lot better after driving it.

Also, the BOV had been opening slightly at idle, causing a lean condition. This had been an on-going problem that I hadn't tracked down. I happened to notice it when I pulled the car in the garage this week and I wonder if it has anything to do with the breather vent I have added on the valve cover. With the old hose I had, I would occasionally find the dip stick popped out of the tube, and I imagine there was some crack-case pressure (bad). Now, the dip-stick hasn't popped up, and there seems to be more vacuum at idle. This was pulling the BOV open enough to run lean. now, any air pulled through has already been metered.

At idle, my mixture was very rich (12.3:1). I loosened the AFM bypass screw and it idles at about 13.5:1 now. I would like this closer to 14.5 or so, but I imagine it is ok as-is. Fueling is quite good right now, with approximately 11.5-12.3:1 AFR's. I have the BEGI all the way opened, and it seems like I could use either the 2.5 bar fpr to reduce fuel pressure slightly, and then correct with the BEGI adjustment needle valve. Hope to try that in a few weeks.

More details to come later this week.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Right now, the car is running probably the smoothest since I have owned it, and I think a lot of it has to do with the recirculation that I set up last week. No more stumbling after shifts, and no more lean idle. There's almost no more BOV noise, but that's OK with me :heehee:

My BOV: I believe it is an Audi replacement/aftermarket valve-- I had purchased it on ebay, and it seems to be working well. I liked it because it wasn't plastic, it had hose connections, and a spring adjustment in case it was too stiff or too soft. Here's a schematic of the way my valve is set up, the only difference being my valve is placed right before the throttle plate, so excess pressure is vented right at the throttle.

Image

Image

Image


According to the discussion, this may help boost build slightly, along with reduce the load in conditions like idle where air can bypass the turbo and intercooler. Anybody else tried theirs this way?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-930- ... v-lag.html

I let my friend Mike (who did the engine swap with me) drive the car again. He has been able to ride in it/drive it at a few of the major milestone points and give me some feedback. Back in October he drove the car and was surprised with how nicely it was running (with the old turbo) since we had first started it up.

Yesterday, he agreed that power delivery was much smoother than before, not much a launch you back in the seat all at once, but rather progressive acceleration until you look down and realize how fast you are going. He was really impressed with how much smoother the car is running in general, and mentioned he thought the car felt faster than his M635 (at altitude)!

I would still like to tinker around with swapping the 2.5bar FPR (at another location), and possibly getting the 10psi wastegate spring from my brother. As I mentioned before, 10psi is really the max for me with stock headgaskets and head bolts. Want to keep it reliable :)

An older photo I found that is pretty cool:

Image

I installed Ireland Engineering fixed camber plates (e30maxplate) only to hear them rubbing when coming out of my driveway. This was disappointing, especially since after some digging, I found that others on this board had the same problem. My beef is that they didn't advertise the plates would make the springs rub, even though I specified my car and they advertise E24 fitment. Additionally, the plates have studs that aren't long enough on one side, and too long on the other side. Lastly, they didn't fit the strut bearings well-- I had to force them together with a pair of channel locks.

So, i decided to order the Turner fixed camber plates since I noticed them on sale. I was able to install them tonight, and the front of the car feels much more willing to change direction than ever before. The best part--no rubbing of the springs.

I am hoping to return the IE plates, we will see what they say.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

A few updates:

I got a deal on some used Performance Friction 11 pads from a E36 M3, so I installed them in preparation for my upcoming track day. I was originally looking for 08's after conversations with a few people, but I couldn't argue the entry cost for these PFC 11's. Just breaking them in, they are must better at stopping the car than the stock pads. Of course there is a little squeaking too though.

I got the boost controller in the mail and it does seem to make a difference in mid range drivability/spool! Small difference, but noticeable at least. I messed with it briefly and adjust boost to 11psi before bringing it back down right away. Have to continue dialing fueling before upping the boost.
I used the dawes-device unit and am very happy with it. I will get pictures at some point...

I also put in the E36 M3 Euro shift lever (E46 M3, E39 M5) and that placed the knob in the same position as stock. The Z3 shifter was nice, but it sat lower than my liking and made 2nd gear difficult to shift into on cold mornings. The throw is in between the Z3 and the stock lever, but finding each gear is more precise than the stock lever.

I took the car on Saturday in for an alignment. Front camber was a pleasant -1.6 and -1.8, with rear about the same at -1.8 and -1.9. I had toe set at -0.5* toe on each side.

My recent free time has been used researching vehicle handling as I now have a few aftermarket handling parts on my car. This has made me interested in general handling trends/characteristics. Here is some nice information I found that I wanted to save for later use.

Image

Posted elsewhere here on mye28:
Image

Image

Image

Image


On the road, the (Turner Motorsport) camber plates improved turn in response, and with the new shocks/springs, the car feels solid and fairly compliant. Only in cold weather (below 50 F) does it feel rough on the bumpy roads. Returned the IE plates, as they told me varying information from me installing the parts wrong, to the parts not fitting any 633's, to fitting only 635's (like my E12 based car, no way). But they accepted the return which was nice. Excited for the next steps!
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
captain awesome
Posts: 213
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2015 3:40 pm
Location: Bentonville, AR

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by captain awesome »

Love the updates. Especially all of the suspension tuning charts.
84 633csi 5 spd

6727698
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

So I got some work done today on the car. I drove out to my Welder's place and put the car up in the air.

After taking off the rear wheel, I saw the rear sway bar mount sheared off the unibody. in effect, i have driven all week with no rear bar. It was predictable and understeered a bit more, that's all. I was going to get this fixed as I saw the problem starting to develop a couple weeks ago. Recall this is a 633, so the mounts are the early style. They are weaker than the later e28 mounts, and nobody has a reinforcement fix for them

Where it failed:
Image


I had my welder re-weld the stock locations, although they are mounted in a location that is somewhat flimsy. I added a 1/4" thick plate of steel to the back side to hopefully give some structural support. We figured the underbody was the best bet since everything else around this location was super thin sheet metal.

Image

The passenegr side is boxed in somewhat already to the heat shield/splash guard for the gas tank. We decided to add another one of these small plates to the face of the guard, and the corners of the bracket.

Image

We had to trim down the weld beads a bit because the IE mounting plate needed to sit flush against this bracket. I hope they both hold up at the upcoming track day.

Image

Unfortunately on the way home, my AFR's became very rich. To the tune of 11.5 idling and 12.5 cruising. The only thing I did from when I parked it was unplug the battery so that the welding wouldn't damage the electronics. Nothing else was touched... If you recall I am running no O2 and was operating off whatever map the Motronic has stored (-6% fuel due to FQS setting). For reference, the idle before was about 13-13.5 idling and 14.7 cruise --the settings were really close to what I wanted! I just checked, and fuel pressure was at 40psi when idling...

Any ideas?
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
hornhospital
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 2929
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:46 pm
Location: Silverhill, AL
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by hornhospital »

I'd guess the Motronic is trying to "relearn" the settings after being unplugged. I don't know if it will be successful, since it has no O2 sensor to judge from.
Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

hornhospital wrote:I'd guess the Motronic is trying to "relearn" the settings after being unplugged. I don't know if it will be successful, since it has no O2 sensor to judge from.
You were in fact correct! I didn't think this version of Motronic saved any settings but it does! See below:

I was able to get under the car today and spray those exposed metal parts with body undercoating.

I also bled my brakes with Typ 200 (amber version of super blue) and installed my spare set of summer tires. They are summer tires that have probably 15000 street miles and also 5 track days on them (mounted on E28 M5 wheels). I noticed that the driver side caliper is sticking a little bit with the new pads. I will work it in and out tomorrow to hopefully solve that issue.


In other news, I started the car up and was getting very rich idle, 11-12 AFR's like I described yesterday. I reconnected the stock Narrowband O2 sensor and let it idle for a bit before taking it around the block. Of course, target 14.7 mixtures were achieved which was good.

Next, I disconnected the O2 sensor at the plug. Mixtures were close 15:1 idle, so I took it for a drive. All of the sudden my normal 14.7 cruise (open loop) was restored. Obviously the narrowband input somehow saves to the ECU. I am not sure if this is in threshold "brackets" or what, but good to know that if I disconnect the battery, this will restore my mixture.

I don't leave it connected all the time because I disconnected my TPS WOT signal, so under boost the computer actually fights injector hold time to achieve 14.7 (bad!), where the RRFPR still increases fuel pressure. This alternate methods seems to work reliably in my experience, and I could return to stock form if I wanted... Obviously my AFM didn't need to be adjusted either. I can simply turn the idle bypass screw and slightly dial in the mixture if I like. (For reference I am doing this with 24lb injectors and the FQS switch at -6% fuel.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
hornhospital
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 2929
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:46 pm
Location: Silverhill, AL
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by hornhospital »

Excellent! =D>
Ken Kanne
'84 633CSi "Sylvia"; '85 635CSi "Katja";'85 325e "Hazel Ann"; '95 M3 "Ashlyn"
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

So this week I was able to get the car out to the track with all of the major items installed. I wasn't quite happy with my mixtures, but didn't want to spend the day fiddling, so I went with the setting on the BEGI. Those settings were full open needle valve and center screw of RRFPR. Transition to boost was slightly rich (12.5:1), and with boost got progressively richer down to 11:1 and even in the high 10's on the long straight. I didn't get the correct restrictor with the BEGI, but I was using a .080" vacuum connection. From what I read this was the same as supplied with the begi from the start. Either way, the car would cruise at about 14.2:1 and this got worse in colder temperatures, so I was hoping for a warmer day.

We drove out to the track and my friend Mike who swapped the engine with me decided to cruise out with us for his first time ever at a track. He really seemed to enjoy the sights and sounds. Here's a photo of his '86 635CSi with the early euro bumpers behind my car.

Image

I had installed the Racemark steering wheel earlier in the week, but had found it to obstruct my view of the gauges (330mm). It felt really nice and made the car seem to steer more quickly, but I decided to put on a similar wheel that I purchased, I think it is 350 or 360mm. It's the same steering wheel, but instead of leather, it had a worn suede material. This was great compromise between the stock wheel and the 330mm and was very easy to grip with driving gloves.

Image

A couple photos of the engine bay. Fuel pressure gauge is still in there for fine tuning. At some point I will have to clean up the wiring. I have the WOT connection disconnected with terminals if I wanted to reconnect it. You can also see the Turner fixed camber plates.

Image

Image

I swapped on the BBS RS wheels again, with the same tires as last fall for comparison purposes.

Image

Image

The BMW friends joined in once again, and my brother finally got his 318is out with us. If you recall, last fall he blew a cooling pipe as we were leaving for the track. He had bought this car with E36 5 lug swap and bolt in cage. He let me drive it later in the day and it did very well. For reference he was able to run 2:23/2:24's with it, about the same speed or faster than my stock 535i E28.

Image

stock 325i 4 door

Image

E39 540i/6 (and some Style 66's I sold him)

Image

Another 540i

Image

Pretty serious E36.

Image

My dad's 1602. My older brother was driving it. I was able to take the wheel later in the day and play cat/mouse with the 318is (for about 35 minutes straight!). The cars were so even, we weren't able to get around each other without point-by's on the straights. Now of course we weren't taking chances, but it was really awesome to drive. Adjustable camber plates, larger front sway bar, 9.3:1 2L M10, bolt in cage, 3.91 diff, (old) r-compound tires. Was really easy to slide around and induce off-throttle oversteer. You drive it like the gas-powered indoor carts and get on the gas as early as possible in the turns. I was really surprised to feel how similar it makes power to the M30B34. It falls off at 5500rpm, so there's no point in revving it out as there is more torque in the next gear at about 4000rpm.

Image

Image

Image

A friends e28 lemons 535i was there also. I have a bit of video but the driver was still working on lines and such. I rode with him and gave him some pointers in his 5 series AWD wagon.

Image

Image

But onto the E24. It really was blast to drive! With the reinforced sway bar mounts and mason engineering strut bars, the chassis felt solid and the rear of the car felt a lot more tossable than ever before. My 535i always seemed to understeer with the shame shocks/springs but stock sway bars. Power delivery from the turbo was fairly modest, the TCD turbo and manual boost controller meant that power delivery was very smooth, and never sudden. This made it very easy to drive, and with the recirculating setup and new exhaust, the car was super quiet. No BOV noises or anything, but it did allow me to really listen to the tires when feeling out the car.

The most challenging thing about driving this car was the brakes. With the PFC 08 race pads all around (E32/E34 BBK), the brakes felt awesome. But the rears always locked up first- recall this car doesn't have ABS. This was a new challenge for me, and forced me to get the car slowed down before entering the corner. I didn't play with trail-braking because of this, but I was fine with that. It meant I tended to brake early and get on the gas at or before the apex so I could get max acceleration out of the turn and on the straights. As the day went on, this tendency to lock got worse, mainly because of low fuel. Next time, I may put the spare tire back in on the track for some extra ballast/balance during braking. Otherwise, I might have to relocate the battery or remove the AC compressor.

Regardless, I really enjoyed it out on the track, and with the same tires as last time, I was able to shave a good 5-6 seconds off my laps time. Obviously 8psi vs 11psi before was a difference, but I think I was hitting the same straightaway speeds. I know I was losing power on the straights at 11:1 AFR's. Once I dial in fueling a bit more, I may go to 10psi, but I want to keep it reliable and I want to be very comfortable with the power level before stepping up. I don't want to pop a headgasket just because of lap times. I enjoy pushing lap times via driver skill rather than vehicle power.

Some more great photos:

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Temps were about 60 degrees, but I liked that it would keep the engine cool. I know my oil got hot after each session, but I don't have temp gauge for that (or an oil cooler yet). I was able to pass both 540i's, one which have the 6 pot front brakes, along with the Ford Focus ST (seen in the video below). The car felt really good and it really seemed like a good bit of power for the car. It ran all day, about 125 track miles and didn't have any hiccups. The only issue was a shimmy under braking, even with new control arms. I should have gotten the HD ones :evil: .

The tires were squealing quite a bit and I think very much becoming the limiting factor in my lap times. Of course dropping some weight would help the car, but I do like it being streetable with quiet interior and radio. I don't know, maybe it would be quiet enough if I took out the carpeting, parcel self, seats and other (along with AC). I know that the rear seats are pretty light, but still.
More photos for those interested: (not mine) https://www.flickr.com/photos/steveandm ... 777408214/

Also, some more car setup notes that I thought were useful. I didn't experiment with tire pressures, but I may do that to try to get different braking characteristics next time.
Car Setup Notes

Springs
Run as soft as practical for maximum grip
Hard:
◾Reduced Grip
◾Increased reaction

Soft:
◾Increased Grip
◾Decreased reaction

Soft Front, Hard rear = Oversteer
Hard Front, Soft rear = Understeer

Anti-Roll
Primary effect in slow turns
Front:
◾Hard = Steering precision in slow turns, understeer, bad turn-in, more precise handling
◾Soft = Grip in slow turns, oversteer, better turn-in, less precise handling

Rear:
◾Hard = Reduce Understeer in slow turns, oversteer, better turn-in
◾Soft = Reduce Oversteer in slow turns, understeer, worse turn-in

Large effect on relative L/R tire temp, Soft front/hard rear may balance. Run zero or low in wet conditions. Harder increases tire ware

Dampers (Shocks/Anti-shock)
Dampers work in speed rates (Fast (low numbers) and Slow (high numbers)) not Soft or Hard
Slow Dampers
◾Slow F+R = Slow weight transfer, Corner stability
◾Fast F+R = Fast weight transfer, Good grip
◾Slow F, Soft R = Corner entry+exit oversteer
◾Fast F, Hard R = Corner entry+exit understeer

Fast Dampers
◾Fast Rebound will normally need to be faster than Fast bound.
◾Slow F+R = Reduced bounce over bumps and curbs
◾Fast F+R = Good grip over bumps and curbs
◾Slow F, Soft R = Bump understeer
◾Fast F, Hard R = Bump oversteer


Bound/Rebound (Mainly for Slow dampers (weight shift)):
Front Bound
◾Slow = Slower weight shift under Brake, Reduce oversteer on Turn-in
◾Fast = Faster weight shift under Brake, Better Turn-in response + Reduce understeer

Rebound
◾Slow = Slower Nose Lift under Accel
◾Fast = Faster Nose Lift under Accel

Rear Bound
◾Slow = Slower weight shift under Accel
◾Fast = Faster weight shift under Accel

Rebound
◾Slow = Slower Nose Drop under Brake, Better Turn-in response + Reduce understeer
◾Fast = Faster Nose Drop under Brake, Reduce oversteer on Turn-in

Slow dampers
Left turn Oversteer Right turn Oversteer
Corner Entry Increase FR Bump, Decrease RL Rebound Increase FL Bump, Decrease RR Rebound
Corner Exit Increase FL Rebound, Decrease RL Bump Increase FR Rebound, Decrease RR Bump

Left turn Understeer Right turn Understeer
Corner Entry Decrease FR Bump, Increase RL Rebound Decrease FL Bump, Increase RR Rebound
Corner Exit Decrease FL Rebound, Increase RR Bump Decrease FR Rebound, Increase RL Bump

Differential
Power
◾High = Good propulsion out of corners, power understeer, Snap oversteer with overpower
◾Low = Poor propulsion out of corners, power oversteer, easier but more frequent traction loss with overpower

Coast
◾High = Stable braking, lift off understeer
◾Low = Unstable braking, lift off oversteer

Pre-load (low throttle range)
◾High = Nervous transitioning from braking/acceleration, easier to balance turns with throttle, harder to keep stable accelerating from slow turns, easy to spin under power, easier to break traction with rapid power lift-off
◾Low = Less responsive transitioning from braking/acceleration, easier to accelerate from slow turns but tendency to understeer

Wing
◾High = Good grip, Oversteer
◾Low = Good speed, Understeer

Tires
After running in (at least two minutes):
◾Target temp = 70-90C (155-195 F)
◾Inner edge should be approximately 5c hotter than the Outer edge, increase camber to increase difference
◾Center temp should be roughly in the middle of the Inner and Outer temps, an increase in tire pressure will raise the center temperature (may require a softening of the springs to counter the effect on handling)

Tire pressure Front:
◾Higher = Oversteer
◾Lower = Understeer

Tire pressure Rear:
◾Higher = Understeer
◾Lower = Oversteer

Brake
Duct
◾Target = 300..600c range while running

◾Bias
◾Target = Front+Back Lock simultaneously

Caster
◾Increase for harder steering + feedback or Understeer
◾Decrease if too firm or unstable in high speed turn
◾Large effect on tire temperature distribution

Camber
Always run negative cambers
Higher neg angle will increase the temperature difference between the inner and outer tire edges
Too high will result in loss of grip

Toe in
Front
◾+ for line stability
◾- for sharp turn-in

Rear
◾+ for line speed
◾- for rear end stability in turns

Front ride height
Front
◾High = Understeer
◾Low = Oversteer

Rear ride height
◾High = Oversteer
◾Low = Understeer
VIDEOS
Afternoon traffic after getting more comfortable with the car. According to my gopro my fast lap was about a 2:19, about 5-6 seconds faster than in the fall:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FydYgLWbiKQ

My brother's video of the 318is. Part of the day he was in a different run group:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F7JQ20zucqM

Can't wait until the next one!
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
baders
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 1084
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2014 7:38 am
Location: Perth Australia

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by baders »

That track day looks like great fun ! I really like how you have installed the dash mounted gauges to rotate with the G forces !
1986 635csi LOCUTUS / Arktis Blau Metallic / Pearl Beige / S38B36/ Close ratio dogleg 5sp
2002 E46 M3 / Topaz Blau Metallic / Black Nappa / 6 speed SMG software tuned / Bilstein PSS10 Coilovers / CMP RACP reinforcement
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

:lol: A low priority item obviously. I do like the placement, very easy to check. I will have to get a new gauge pod soon and mount it better :oops:
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

I looked into this rear brake-bias problem a bit more to find the following:

As best as I can tell, my car without ABS links RF and LR together as I suspected. In the case that one side of the system fails, there will be brakes on both sides, and in front and back, as opposed to on one side only, or in the front/back only.

Here are the RealOEM diagrams that I think are supposed to be linked together:
Image Image

Item 15 is BRAKE PRESSURE REGULATOR (34331154025), and is only used on the E24 (but not M6). There isn't a lot of information for these, but they simply limit braking force at the rear of the car at a proportional rate. I found some additional in-depth information on this here: http://stoptech.com/technical-support/t ... ing-valves


So I could attempt to find another valve from BMW with the right characteristics, but since there is almost no information on these valves, especially compared to one another, I don't think this is a feasible option.

I could use an aftermarket valve, IE sells one with BMW M10x1 female brake connections: http://www.iemotorsport.com/bmw/2002-br ... valve.html

Ideally, one of these valves would be used to 'dial-down' the rear braking force as desired. In thinking about it, I would have to isolate the front and rear circuits. Below is a diagram of how I would do it. Basically make one brake circuit Fronts and the rear circuit go through the brake bias valve before distributing to both rear calipers. I'm not sure if the brake proportioning valves should be removed or not-- their non-linear performance seems like it is a safety feature...

Image
I think I would need simply 3 or 4 flexible brake hoses to make it work.

I'm not sure if this is the route I want to go, or if a different pad selection would be better. I like the idea of being able to adjust bias as required, but I don't want to over complicate the problem either...
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
Spasso
Posts: 545
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:20 pm
Location: The Jet City, USA

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by Spasso »

Really great looking pictures on the track.
The 6 is the best looking car out there.
I don't care what anyone says!
Dutch
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:11 am
Location: Zwolle, The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by Dutch »

Great work, you really revived that car. Keep the updates coming!
1982 BMW 628CSi
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Thanks guys. Some more content from that day.
Here are some photos from the event website. The 633 was the first image shown!

Image

The 318 in action
Image

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80PoF9ZEkXo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZiiZ6LHFSE

A brief video from behind (the lemons E28 535i). You can certainly see how the heavier 633 is able to corner the same speed (with suspension upgrades), but then take off on the straights:

https://youtu.be/b_H6WyxVDhU?t=42m35s

Trying to figure out when the next one will be! they aren't exactly cheap...
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Thinking about taking a day off of work for a lapping day either May 20th or May 27. I also picked up some 17" M-Systems with R-comp tires. I'm planning to run them, but I am a bit worried about my rear sway bar mount with the additional forces.

Haven't done anything about the brake bias except order some lower performance rear pads. Not sure if I want to run them or not.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Did hit another track day yet, but with the warmer temperatures I went out on a drive a few weeks ago. A friend asked to join, so we went in the late afternoon. He bought this 930 years ago after a fire (aptly named, Scorch) and I was surprised at how well my car was able to keep up with it!

Cool 60 degree temperatures felt great!

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

We did a bit of dirt road driving, climbing to over 9000ft.
Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Overall the car did very well, and reaching 7000ft along most of the journey, it was sure nice for the car to not feel 'out of breath' due to altitude! Quite a contrast to the same route in my 535i.

still trying to decide if I want to go with a brake proportioner or not. I haven't decided but have been doing misc fixes on the other cars and the house lately.


I also recently added a 2.5bar fpr which seemed to help improve my midrange AFR's. Still dialing it in as perfect settings change based on ambient temperature.

I basically set the Idle mixture screw (14.5:1) after everything gets up to temperature, and then I tweak the two settings on the RRFPR for proper 12:1 AFR's under boost.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
Viktor D.
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:55 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by Viktor D. »

These pictures are absolutely magnificent! :shock:
I would love to drive on roads with such a beautiful scenery! [-o<

Keep the pictures coming! :D
________________________
Viktor
Belgium

1984 BMW 635CSi 5spd
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Viktor D. wrote:These pictures are absolutely magnificent! :shock:
I would love to drive on roads with such a beautiful scenery! [-o<

Keep the pictures coming! :D

Thanks! Ask and you shall receive:

I had the car loaded up for a track day at a new track, but then they told me it got cancelled due to flooding.

I was seriously bummed out because I had some R-comps to throw on and test out :x I also swapped to a 2.5bar FPR which seemed to get to really close to target AFM's under boost (before it was a bit too rich with the RRFPR all the way open).

Anyway, I went down to Colorado Springs for the weekend and stayed at my brother's house. We made some progress on his cars and then took a late night drive.

His Euro E30. In the process of refreshing and titleing. We had actually swapped the front springs before taking this photo:
Image


Image

Image

This old mining town was pretty neat to see. The pass to get to this town was over 10,000 feet. The car really did awesome with the cool temperatures and the elevation.
Image

Image

Image

Image

I have noticed that if temperatures get above 80F, I have to trim the ECU using the FQS switch to -3% fuel, and above 95F to standard 0% fuel change (Below 80, the -6% covers the entire range). I suspect it is related to the trim adjustment (based on temperature) built into the M1.0. My larger injectors overcompensate rich/lean with exaggerated temps. I still haven't messed with the AFM...
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Took the car to D4C 2016 last weekend and got a great feel for the RRFPR setup in the mountains with probably 6-7 passes at 10,000ft or higher on the trip. The MS2 will be much better for all around usage and work should commence in about another two weeks.

Here's a video with turbo noises and some mountain views if you like.

https://youtu.be/Dhe2ctz2P_s
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
BamaE24

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by BamaE24 »

Nice video. I really like the pictures too. I dunno why I haven't looked in this thread before. Your 633 has made a big change from the first photo to the last. It's really inspirational.
francoid

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by francoid »

Very nice video, Tom, but you need a windshield?
User avatar
tschultz
Posts: 2515
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 10:54 pm
Location: Colorado
Contact:

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by tschultz »

Thanks Fancois. A windshield is rather low on the priority list... this car isn't a show car.
http://www.Drive4Corners.com
Image
'79 635CSi Revival
'80 635CSi
'83 633CSi Callaway Turbo continued as 1988 535is Turbo
SOLD: '81 635CSi/A
francoid

Re: 633CSi Callaway Turbo Car

Post by francoid »

Looks like a fun car!

My 635 is in the midst of a major overhaul... Let's see if I'll be able to put it back together! ;)
Post Reply