Sport seat repair work in progress---few questions

[rchirnom]

I'm in the middle of repairing my driver's seat, and I've got a few questions. These are memory electric sport seats from an 85. My problem was that I had twisting and the seat tilt would only go up so high. Turns out that the hinges each had 1-2 teeth missing. So I've got new hinges and put them in, and I'm going to reassemble everything now.

Question 1.
I took a look at my gearbox, and on the passenger side, some of the cogs on one gear are a bit mangled. (see photos below). I haven't lost any whole cogs, but one I lost a big chunk. It seems like this is probably not too far gone, and I can re-use the gearbox without worry. What do you guys think? The internals of the gearbox were fine.

Question 2.
My driver's seat has a lot of wear of course, but mostly on the outer bolster of the seat back. So, I was thinking to swap the driver and passenger seat backs. Can this be done? Before I go and take the passenger seat apart, is the headrest motor on the right-hand (vehicle outer side)? In other words are the two seat backs identical or are they are mirror image? If mirror image, is there enough wire to feed the wires through the other hinge?

Question 3.
I was thinking of removing the passenger seatback while it is in the car. But based on the difficult time I had removing the seat back of the driver's side while separated from the car, this seems a bit tough. Comments?

Thanks for any insights...
Ryan

[rchirnom]

Well, I decided just to go with it for the gears. They seem fine enough. Then, I tried to remove the passenger seat to do the seatback switcheroo, but I couldn't get it out because the wiring harness is zip-tied to the frame of the seat at a point where I couldn't figure out how to reach it to cut it (sort of halfway in the front-back direction). So then I tried to remove the seat back with the seat still in the car, but I when I got to the point of taking off the gold metal ring for the seat flip-release, I got worried about breaking parts. It is a hell of a lot harder to do anything with less mobility and light because the seat is still in the car in a dimly lit garage. So, I'm gonna just mothball the car for a week or two while I have the driver's side seatback re-stitched and un-twisted.

But so far it is a success...I got the bad hinges out and replaced (thanks Ralph) and the new hinges are waiting for a new-and-improved seatback to be attached. Everything is really sturdy now. One thing is kind of funny...when I'm disassembling something, I curse how well this car is built. But when putting it back together, it's really satisfying...

[Ralph in Socal]

Hey Ryan,

Nice work but I would change out that bad gear as it can start the process of destroying your hinge. Pending successful implementation of proper memory functions, I can have one in the mail pronto and you should have it before you get the leather re-stitching done.

Ralph

[rchirnom]

You mean replace just the bad gear (as opposed to a whole gearbox)? Not a bad idea. I certainly don't want to have to replace the hinges again if I don't need to. But, how do you detach that gear from the rest of the gearbox assembly? I didn't really dig into it, but it seemed like the internal gears were loosely placed in the housing with their spindles in a hole, but the external gears seemed to be secured to the housing somehow. How is it done?

[rchirnom]

One other question...It seems possible that the root cause of my broken hinge and seat twist relates to the cables (or, it could have been the weight of previous drivers). When I took the seat apart, I found that of the four cables going to the gearboxes, in three of the cables, the metal cable inside the plastic sheath would not rotate when I twisted the hinge-side end of the cable. Presumably this means that the square end of cable is properly seated in the motor. However, one of the metal cables would spin freely (the seatback tilt cable going to the right side). I presume that this means that the metal cable was not properly seated in the motor due to shortening of the metal etc. So I replaced that cable and made sure that it did not spin when re-assembled. Then I reassembled the hinges, gearbox etc.

So, here's the question. I am confident that the motor-side ends of the cables are properly seated. How can I really know if the hinge-side ends are properly seated? Is the only way to test powering up the seat? I feel like it is probably ok, but I am afraid of what might happen when I run the motors (like, one side not being properly seated, thus causing damage to my lovely new hinges).

[Ralph in Socal]

Ryan,

Gears are replaceable in the gearboxes. Too much grease in the way so I did not disassemble the gear but the entire assembly of inner gear and outer gear falls out when the case is opened. I'll send you a gearbox with a bad case and you can take what parts you need out of it. Unfortunately this will cost you $5.50 to ship (USPS Priority Small Box) because of weight.

The only way to test is to power up the seat and run it. You will not ruin a hinge or gearbox in the process unless you keep powering up even if you see a problem. The seat will "twist" if one side is not seated properly. The hinges actually provide the movement for "Seat Back" forward and recline as well as "Rear Seat Bottom" up and down. If a cable is not seated you will either twist the seat back or twist the seat bottom. Simply reverse movement until aligned, remove the cable from the gear box and shorten the outer sheath by a half inch (use a razor knife to cut the plastic) and reassemble and test. Repeat if necessary. Same repair as for the headrest cable.

Ralph

[rchirnom]

Awesome, thanks Ralph! Your supply of parts is amazing. I'll paypal the cash over to you ASAP.

As for testing it out, I guess I will cross my fingers and hope I don't have to do it all again. I guess the truth is, I can test it out before I re-attach the seat back, so that if something is wrong, there are fewer steps to retrace. If everything is properly connected, I should be able to see the posts of the hinges moving in sync. This way, I can test it out while the upholstery shop has the seat back.

[rchirnom]

Ok, replaced that gear and tested everything out. All movements worked ok and in sync. The only thing is that there was a bit of a high pitched whine coming from one of the gearboxes, I think. So I opened them up again and removed some of the old gummy grease and replaced it with fresh grease. Maybe that will quiet things down a bit.

One other thing...about the thigh support. When I removed the seat, I found that the thigh support was disconnected, so I reconnected it. As before, it is still dead (can't even hear the motor running). I suppose it could be either the switch or a stuck motor. A broken switch seems unlikely...how does one unstick a motor? Just a bang with a hammer? Anyway, even if I can't get the thigh support working, its not a big deal.

Now to sit and wait while the upholstery shop re-sews a seam and straightens out the seat back frame. Then I should have an almost as good-as-new seat!

[rchirnom]

Mission accomplished!!
Thanks to Ralph for the parts etc.
Check it out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_JFTaLADUI

[bghalio]

Ralph:

I think I stripped a gear in my passenger front sport seat vertical actuator 52101382950 attempting to manually raise the front of the seat with a square bit and a drill (1985 E24).

Do you have this part or a repair kit for same?

Thanks Much

[Mamod17]

IMG_8909 copy2.jpg (631.02 KiB) Viewed 8521 times

Hi I hope you don't mind me jumping on the post but I'm also in the process of pulling my seats apart and I've hit a stumbling block the drivers side (Aussie, right seat). I've managed to get the left side of the backrest loosened enough to get it off but on the right side the headrest motor is wired into the back of the seat and I'm not sure how do get it off. I unscrewed the motor from the backrest but the wires go straight into the gearing and theres not enough room just to pull the motor out. Any help would be appreciated!

[rhanley 635csi89]

If I read your post correctly, the back of the seat hasn't been removed? If correct it's easy to remove. Remove the plastic cover which is around the latch, 2 screws. Look inside the leather were the latch is and you'll see two move screws holding the latch in place, remove the screws and the back should come off.

[Mamod17]

Thanks for the reply! I've manage to get that far but the motor for the headrest is in the back of the seat and thats attached to the bottom hinge...I disconnected the motor but theres no room to 'slip it throng and slide the top backrest off...

[rhanley 635csi89]

I'm having trouble visualizing the situation. Is the problem the cable or motor? The cables can be removed from the motors and/or gears by removing the two to four bolts the hold the bracket/cable in place. The cable can then be threaded through the hinge hole if its the cable or the motor can be replaced base on the problem you have. I've found removing the entire seat from the car and working on them saves time in the long run.

[Mamod17]

Thanks. I've got the seat out. I think I basically have to dismantle the headrest motor and thread the cable through as you suggest... The picture in this post shows the headrest motor the cables I have to disconnect are at the base...I've go the motor and bracket off the frame but theres about 4 boltsthat hold the base of the motor together ..is that what you're referring to?

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[rhanley 635csi89]

I used the word screws in error they are indeed thread machine bolts, no nuts. At the end of the cable there is a silver sleeve that covers the black sheathing (shown in your photo). The sleeve is held in by a bracket which is mounted to the motor by two machine bolts. These two bolts do not have to be completely removed, just loose enough to remove the cable as the cable sleeve has a lip on it that holds it in the bracket.

[Mamod17]

great, thanks I'll give it a go tomorrow! 1.22am here now!

[Mamod17]

Solved - cut the wires...

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[rhanley 635csi89]

I did't realize there was an issue with removing the electric wiring as well as the cable. That's one way to solve the electric wire issue. The electric wire has connectors (pin type) at the end of the wire run under the seat, disconnect the connectors and remove the pins with a pin extractor (any auto store has them), then pull the cable through the seat hinge. If you're replacing the motor it should have the connector intact. During reassembly make sure the color wire placement matches up in the male/female connectors.
The move details you provide in your questions will result in more/actuate complete answers. Photo's are a help. Google and YouTube searches can be a great source of information as well. Roger

Cut and paste link below, many types to choose from.

https://www.google.com/search?q=electri ... moval+tool

[Mamod17]

Brilliant, thanks very much for your help. Much appreciated. Next task is to remove the seat base from the frame. Will endeavour to document with photos!

[rhanley 635csi89]

There's 4 10mm machine bolts that hold the seat bottom to the frame one in each corner, I find it easier to remove the entire seat rails and all, as there's four bolts at the end of the floor track, each end, attached to the floor of the car. You can then clean carpet, clean rails etc and re-grease as required.