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Guide Bushing (Centering Bushing) removal/intsatllation

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bowerbird

Guide Bushing (Centering Bushing) removal/intsatllation

Post by bowerbird » Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:28 am

I'm having trouble figuring out to remove/ install the guide bushing that is pressed into the drive shaft at the Giubo/flexdisk. Anybody have tips on removal/instalation?

m6csi

Post by m6csi » Thu Mar 11, 2010 3:51 am

According to the factory shop manual, pack the driveshaft centering guide cavity with a suitable amount of thick grease and drive out using a 14mm drift. I just measured the interior diameter of the centering guide of an old DS in my garage and it is approximately 12.8mm, so a short 1/2" rod will serve as a good drift tool. Suppose when the drift is driven into the grease and works on the hydraulic principle, therefore, forcing out the centering guide.

On installing the new centering guide, the manual states that it should be packed with about 6 grams of Moly longterm grease prior to be driven home. The flat surface of the centering guide also should protrude 5mm from the end of the driveshaft.

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Chris Wright
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Post by Chris Wright » Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:22 am

Here is someones successful experience using the above method (scroll to the end):

viewtopic.php?t=4554&h
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:49 am

Thank you both. I figured a 14" drift would be hard to come by. Thanks x2 for the .5" drift idea.

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:03 am

The grease/drift idea worked like a charm! I picked up a .5" steel rod and put about 4 layers of electrical tape to get the fit pretty flush and went to town. It came out in a couple minutes of whacking and repacking with grease.

Anyone know what the torque spec is for flex disk nuts?

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Chris Wright
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Post by Chris Wright » Fri Mar 12, 2010 7:53 am

bowerbird wrote:The grease/drift idea worked like a charm! I picked up a .5" steel rod and put about 4 layers of electrical tape to get the fit pretty flush and went to town. It came out in a couple minutes of whacking and repacking with grease.

Anyone know what the torque spec is for flex disk nuts?
Here is a free book with all of the torques:
Factory Specification Book
viewtopic.php?p=53625

If there are arrows on the side of the flex disc, they should point toward the flange arms. The bolt heads bear against the flex disc and the nuts bear against the flange arms (so they alternate direction). Hold the bolt heads and tighten the nuts.

Torque:
M10 - 8.8 bolt ...... 34 ft lbs
M10 - 10.9 bolt .... 53 ft lbs
M12 - bolt ........... 90 ft lbs
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Fri Mar 12, 2010 3:45 pm

I'm not clear on the three torque values/sizes...

Torque:
M10 - 8.8 bolt ...... 34 ft lbs
M10 - 10.9 bolt .... 53 ft lbs
M12 - bolt ........... 90 ft lbs

Thanks if you can break this down for me.

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Chris Wright
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Location: Columbus, IN (INDY 500 area)

Post by Chris Wright » Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:27 pm

bowerbird wrote:I'm not clear on the three torque values/sizes...

Torque:
M10 - 8.8 bolt ...... 34 ft lbs
M10 - 10.9 bolt .... 53 ft lbs
M12 - bolt ........... 90 ft lbs

Thanks if you can break this down for me.
Here is a great site explaining just about every type of fastener you can think of, bookmark it:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screw

The torque used depends on the size (outer thread diameter) and grade (markings on the head) of the bolt. Here is an example:

M10 - 8.8 .... 34 ft lbs

M = Indicates Metric size

10 = 10mm outer thread diameter
........ (if it is followed by "x"and a number, it indicates the thread pitch, i.e. x1.0, x1.25 or x1.5 would be 1, 1.25 or 1.5 threads per mm).

8.8 = ISO Grade or strength of bolt, it is marked on the head
........ (ISO 8.8 is approx. = SAE grade 5 bolt and ISO 10.8 approx. = SAE grade 8 bolt)

34 ft lbs = 34 Foot Pounds of torque

An M10 bolt generally takes a 17mm wrench and an M12 a 19mm wrench.
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Fri Mar 12, 2010 7:42 pm

many thanks.

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:47 am

Making slow and steady progress...Guide bushing and center bearing are off...can anyone point me to some tips on installing the replacements without special tools? I've searched but have not found anything so far.

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Chris Wright
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Post by Chris Wright » Sat Mar 13, 2010 4:21 am

You didn't get the welcome wagon of info and links? The online factory workshop manual covers the early Sixer, section 26 covers the propeller shaft:
viewtopic.php?t=10410

Remember to preload the center bearing when you reinstall the shaft.
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Sat Mar 13, 2010 4:59 am

Yes I did get a good set of welcome wagon resources and I've been familiarizing myself with them. There is a lot to know and have not yet achieved a comfortable understanding of all this info. I've read about the pre-loading among other propeller shaft minutia but don't quite get all of it. The factory manual is great for procedural stuff, but does not explain things in principal, hence the confusion on accomplishing things without special tools.

I figured to get the center support bearing on I could use a section of pipe roughly matching the bearing diameter and tap it in. For the guide busing, I Thought I'd us the gear puller to push it in.

I could use some help on the pre-loading aspect of the center support bearing though.

Thanks for all the info so far, I'm intrigued and excited to get my 633 rolling.

m6csi

Post by m6csi » Sat Mar 13, 2010 5:10 am

bowerbird wrote:Making slow and steady progress...Guide bushing and center bearing are off...can anyone point me to some tips on installing the replacements without special tools? I've searched but have not found anything so far.
I completed this job late last year. Here is the thread from BF: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh ... ?t=1309083

Here is some additional info on another BF thread. Scroll to bottom on 2nd page: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh ... 008&page=2

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:09 am

Alright....new question. Spark plug wires. I send back the Bremi ones that did not fire for whatever reason on two cylinders and ordered azautohaus.com's Bosch set. I think they are wrong but can't really be sure. here is what they look like...

http://www.autohausaz.com/search/produc ... Wire%20Set

The plugs do not have the rubber boot like the OEM ones and they wobble about on the plug when installed. Also, cylinder 1 and 2 wires are the same length which, not being sure about the resistance sensitivity and seeing that the originals are all unique lengths, makes me wonder.

I cant start the car right now since the shifter, drive line and exhaust is off but it just doesn't seem right. Anyway, thanks for all previous help and hopefully I'll be at a point soon where I can contribute a little more knowledge than I'm taking.

After searching a bit, I found Spark plug wire connectors consistent with my year, 1980 that look like the bosch set I'm skeptical about. See here.

http://www.partsgeek.com/gbproducts/WC/ ... oogle+Base

Strange, now I'm wondering if the rubber boot style was an upgrade.

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Chris Wright
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Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:12 am
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Post by Chris Wright » Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:25 am

bowerbird wrote: The plugs do not have the rubber boot like the OEM ones and they wobble about on the plug when installed.
Did you unscrew caps on the spark plugs? The OEM wires just use the threaded stud on the ends of the plugs, maybe the new ones need the caps threaded on (but I doubt it)?
Also, cylinder 1 and 2 wires are the same length which, not being sure about the resistance sensitivity and seeing that the originals are all unique lengths, makes me wonder.
The length doesn't matter because the resistance must be approx. the same for all of the wires. To do this, "0 resistance" copper core wires are used and specific resistance connectors are use to make them all equal. You can use a meter to check that.
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Sun Mar 14, 2010 7:49 pm

On guibo installation...

The disk seems semetrical but there are two dots on one side. Not sure if these indicate position rotationnaly, front/back placement, or nothing. The guibo is wrapped in a metal shield. Is this removed afer installation. Lastly, I was told 34lbs of torque on nuts... Can anyone confirm? Again I appreciate the help.

Also, interestingly the clamping ring I ordered from pelican parts does not fit...the metal part does, but the toothed rubber seal that slides over the splines has too many teeth and does not mesh. I think I'll just re-use the rubber from the old one. Its banged up and missing a tooth or two but is still plyable and seems to be more of a dust guard than anything.

Anyone order one that actually fit? Not much discussion on these.

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Chris Wright
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Posts: 5718
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:12 am
Location: Columbus, IN (INDY 500 area)

Post by Chris Wright » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:04 pm

You might want to start a new thread for this question, new questions on the tail of old ones don't always get a lot of viewers?
bowerbird wrote:On guibo installation...

The disk seems symmetrical but there are two dots on one side. Not sure if these indicate position rotationally, front/back placement, or nothing.
I don't know about the dots (have you looked for a small installation sheet in the box?), but some discs come with arrows on the sides that point to flanges for installation, but with the band you can't see them so it may not have the arrows, look after you remove it to be sure. Just out of curiosity, look at the face of the flex disc, Is there extra rubber bridging the space between every other pair of bolt holes? I'm wondering if the arrows ensure that this extra rubber is preceding the bolt on the output flange or trailing it (rubber in tension or compression)?

just looked this up in the factory CD and the center bearing pre-load for the e12 cars is different, it is 2mm (0.08") forward instead of the 4 to 6mm for the later cars.

The CD also shows, for an e12, a flex disc with the arrows on the sides for the Automatic Transmission (the later Autos used a U-Joint) and calls it a "Hardy Disc". Scroll down and it shows a slightly different looking "Giubo Coupling", saying to remove the strap you describe, so I'm wondering if they are two different parts, depending on whether it is an Auto or Manual? Could you post up a picture?
The guibo is wrapped in a metal shield. Is this removed after installation.
The Bentley manual suggests using a large hose clamp around the sides to compress the flex disc slightly to ease the installation of the bolts and I have read of some of the disks coming with the band you speak of, so yes remove it after installation.

Lastly, I was told 34lbs of torque on nuts... Can anyone confirm? Again I appreciate the help.
What is the size and grade of your bolts? It depends on the size.

The Bentley, The Factory CD, The BMW Spec. book .... they all say the same thing (although the values are slightly different).
Also, interestingly the clamping ring I ordered from pelican parts does not fit...the metal part does, but the toothed rubber seal that slides over the splines has too many teeth and does not mesh. I think I'll just re-use the rubber from the old one. Its banged up and missing a tooth or two but is still plyable and seems to be more of a dust guard than anything.

Anyone order one that actually fit? Not much discussion on these.
Call them and find out if they sent the wrong part, your '80 is e12 based and may be different.
___________


You might find these interesting even though they are for a 3 series:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/BMW/techart ... -Guibo.htm
http://www.pelicanparts.com/BMW/techart ... earing.htm
__________________________
Chris Wright
'87 635Csi
3 MGA's
MG 1100

bowerbird

Post by bowerbird » Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:14 am

Here is a pic of the Guibo. Note dots...other side looks the same but no dots. No arrows on metal strap, Bold heads read 10.9

Image

bowerbird

A couple pics of the CSI

Post by bowerbird » Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:38 am

My buddy and I got the The drive shaft with renewed parts re-installed and the car runs wonderfully. There is still some stuff left to do but I'm feeling great about the car so far. I finally was able to get it out of the garage for some pictures....

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