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Whats up with no Euro Chain Tensioners?

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GaAlpinaowner
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Whats up with no Euro Chain Tensioners?

Post by GaAlpinaowner » Tue Aug 12, 2014 1:36 pm

#@[email protected][email protected]#$ this is ridiculous. Why can't BMW make more M635CSI timing chain rail tensioners? There are quite of few of these cars around and the part is somewhat critical....WTF

part # 11 31 1 307 442

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rmorin1249
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Post by rmorin1249 » Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:15 pm

Penske parts still has a listing. If it's unique to the Euro cars you may have trouble getting it even if it's still available.

http://www.penskeparts.com/DiagramsMain ... +1+307+442

Schmiedmann lists it here:

http://www.schmiedmann.com/11311307442/ ... umber.aspx
Randall Morin
COL(Ret), US Army
1985 M635 Euro
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ericono
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Post by ericono » Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:36 pm

Which part would I want (they both have the same part number, but are listed twice):
18 11311307442 CHAIN TENSIONER 0.45 1 $222.11
18 11311307442 CHAIN TENSIONER L Strearing 0.45 1 $222.11
'85 M635, '00 528iT, '98 Z3

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rmorin1249
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Post by rmorin1249 » Tue Aug 12, 2014 6:42 pm

ericono wrote:Which part would I want (they both have the same part number, but are listed twice):
18 11311307442 CHAIN TENSIONER 0.45 1 $222.11
18 11311307442 CHAIN TENSIONER L Strearing 0.45 1 $222.11
My understanding is they list most of the parts twice to differentiate when there is a difference between the Left and Right Hand Drive models.

I think L Stearing is the US version. They seem to not know how to spell "steering" in English.

If I am wrong I am sure someone will correct me.
Randall Morin
COL(Ret), US Army
1985 M635 Euro
Alpine White/Pacific Blue
Hagerstown MD

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Post by GaAlpinaowner » Wed Aug 13, 2014 11:51 am

Yes there are listings but no product to ship. :cry:

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rmorin1249
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Post by rmorin1249 » Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:34 pm

GaAlpinaowner wrote:Yes there are listings but no product to ship. :cry:
This is similar to the story I am getting on my mufflers. Been waiting for 3 months to try to get them out of Germany.

Did you try Schmiedmann and Walloth?
Randall Morin
COL(Ret), US Army
1985 M635 Euro
Alpine White/Pacific Blue
Hagerstown MD

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Post by GaAlpinaowner » Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:55 pm

I will try walloth tomorrow. This sux motor has been apart a while. Sure need a miracle

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Post by ericono » Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:35 am

What are these chain guides made of? I know at least part is plastic, but are they all plastic or plastic bonded to a metal frame? Could someone post some pictures of actual parts, not the diagrams.

My ultimate question is could we reverse engineer them and make some new ones out of delrin or something better than OEM that will last longer (or at least the no worse than original)?

Eric
'85 M635, '00 528iT, '98 Z3

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Post by rmorin1249 » Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:37 am

Is there a recommended mileage interval for replacement or is it based on noise or some other issue? You guys are scaring me.
Randall Morin
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1985 M635 Euro
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Hagerstown MD

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Post by Pod » Thu Aug 14, 2014 1:12 am

ericono wrote:What are these chain guides made of? I know at least part is plastic, but are they all plastic or plastic bonded to a metal frame? Could someone post some pictures of actual parts, not the diagrams.

My ultimate question is could we reverse engineer them and make some new ones out of delrin or something better than OEM that will last longer (or at least the no worse than original)?

Eric
I had the same thoughts. The OEM guides are massively expensive for what they are. The trouble is, if a reverse-engineered part fails, it could work out very much more expensive - and who would volunteer to take the risk?
rmorin1249 wrote: Is there a recommended mileage interval for replacement or is it based on noise or some other issue? You guys are scaring me.
Generally accepted wisdom is to change the whole assembly every 100k miles, but quite a few people will argue that it is unnecessary. I guess you either fork out for it or chance lunching the engine............

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Post by m6dave » Thu Aug 14, 2014 5:22 am

the wear material is bonded to a cast or forged aluminium shoe. Could the dual chain one be milled down to the correct size? I have a set of used dual chain ones that we could experiment with.

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Post by Stoffie » Thu Aug 14, 2014 7:37 am

I recently inquired with my tech to see if all parts were still available to do a full overhaul of the timing chain and its related parts (tensioners, sliding and guide rails, sprockets etc). They are still available here in Europe, possibly under another number than available in the online catalogs like realoem.com

In any case you should still be able to source them through bmwclassic, at least! But my tech just orders his parts through the service department of the nearest BMW dealership.

Massively expensive though, came to about 1700€ or $2300 (US) for all the parts, and only the parts! Just insane for what it is. As stocks deplete and then have to start making new batches, prices just shoot up exponentially.
The M88/3 was all about power, no cats. At idle the raw fuel from the exhaust will make your eyes water like an old V-8 powered muscle car's exhaust did.

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Post by GaAlpinaowner » Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:47 pm

My car has only 46k miles. I discovered headgasket was slightly leaking in the rear. My goal was to replace only the head gasket but as the parts were removed to do this we discovered another issue. Upon inspection the lower chain guide plastic part was cracked on drivers side. I thought perfect time to replace the chain and all the guides. I have everything except the part mentioned. The part I am trying to source is the upper chain guide rail. It has slight wear on it and I can and will probably reuse it. I replaced the other parts I just need the upper. So far there is no stock anywhere in Europe unless someone in Europe has a connection can help me. The conversion to Dual Chain is a option but more than I want to deal with. The US M6 has a very similar upper chain guide but it would need to be machined to fit and honestly the top portion rubber not hard plastic is so soft that it looks like it would be eaten by the euro single chain. I only want to do this once. BMW Classic is of no help as Maximillian can not help either.
Seems to me that BMW Classic would make more of these knowing that there are no more....this just sux and pisses me off. PArt number 11 311 307 442 is the number - if anyone has one they can sell I would be most appreciative....

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Post by Stoffie » Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:59 pm

I just checked BMW Classic's Online Shop Teilesuche (german version) and the part is in the list and has a list price of 199.68€ so I guess it's available for ordering ?

I've added a screenshot as attachment to this post (hope you can see it). Nevermind the Germand and Dutch (can't seem to change it).

BMW Classic Deutschland Online Shop Teilesuche
Attachments
timing.JPG
timing.JPG (69.46 KiB) Viewed 6524 times
The M88/3 was all about power, no cats. At idle the raw fuel from the exhaust will make your eyes water like an old V-8 powered muscle car's exhaust did.

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tensioner

Post by brickwhite » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:05 pm

On the site above you cannot select the tensioner either.
https://shop.bmw-classic.de

Furthermore-

I tried Walloth of Germany they said they could not get that part anymore. I'm in the US and will be needing one also for my M635csi timing update.

If anyone can order this please let us know.

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Re: tensioner

Post by GaAlpinaowner » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:19 pm

brickwhite wrote:On the site above you cannot select the tensioner either.
https://shop.bmw-classic.de

Furthermore-

I tried Walloth of Germany they said they could not get that part anymore. I'm in the US and will be needing one also for my M635csi timing update.

If anyone can order this please let us know.
hey I have first dibs ! [-X
but if anyone help help us please let us know asap
thanks

David Frankel

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ericono
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Post by ericono » Thu Aug 14, 2014 2:26 pm

m6dave wrote:the wear material is bonded to a cast or forged aluminium shoe. Could the dual chain one be milled down to the correct size? I have a set of used dual chain ones that we could experiment with.
Dave,

If it's not too much trouble, could you take some pictures of the different parts? My first thought is if we could remove the old plastic, have new plastic parts machined and then attach the new wear material to the cast or forged aluminum bases.

Thanks,

Eric
'85 M635, '00 528iT, '98 Z3

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Stoffie
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Post by Stoffie » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:21 pm

I'll see if I can pop into a nearby dealer next week to find out whether this part is really NLA or not. My mechanic assured me all the parts were still available...

I'm sure it is available one way or another, but at what price. What's the point of having a Classic division if you can't get the parts ? In that regard MB has their stuff together quite a bit better than BMW if you ask me.
The M88/3 was all about power, no cats. At idle the raw fuel from the exhaust will make your eyes water like an old V-8 powered muscle car's exhaust did.

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Re: tensioner

Post by brickwhite » Fri Aug 15, 2014 1:46 pm

If I find some, I'll let you know first!


('
GaAlpinaowner wrote:aowner"]
brickwhite wrote:On the site above you cannot select the tensioner either.
https://shop.bmw-classic.de

Furthermore-

I tried Walloth of Germany they said they could not get that part anymore. I'm in the US and will be needing one also for my M635csi timing update.

If anyone can order this please let us know.
hey I have first dibs ! [-X
but if anyone help help us please let us know asap
thanks

David Frankel
[-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o<

GaAlpinaowner
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Re: tensioner

Post by GaAlpinaowner » Fri Aug 15, 2014 5:06 pm

Thanks I have looked everywhere and so fay nada
brickwhite wrote:If I find some, I'll let you know first!


('
GaAlpinaowner wrote:aowner"]
brickwhite wrote:On the site above you cannot select the tensioner either.
https://shop.bmw-classic.de

Furthermore-

I tried Walloth of Germany they said they could not get that part anymore. I'm in the US and will be needing one also for my M635csi timing update.

If anyone can order this please let us know.
hey I have first dibs ! [-X
but if anyone help help us please let us know asap
thanks

David Frankel
[-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o< [-o<

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Post by jps635 » Fri Aug 15, 2014 8:27 pm

Plugging the part no. directly into google gets lots of hits, and different results with the 18 and space in front, but for the same part.
I guess you've tried this route? Good luck.
'85 635csi JPS (RA2-66)

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Post by GazM3 » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:08 pm

Hey on the chain tensioner often people replace the m635 one with the superior one from the s50b32 which id imagine are widely available.
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Post by ericono » Fri Aug 15, 2014 10:49 pm

Good point Gaz. I think most of the complaints are related to the guides rather than the tensioner mechanism itself.
'85 M635, '00 528iT, '98 Z3

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Post by sansouci » Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:46 am

Can someone get a technical drawing of the part with all the dimensions? Or use the old part as a basis for the drawing. I'm sure there must be some machine shop that can fab them up?
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Post by Alpinacsi » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:05 pm

sansouci wrote:Can someone get a technical drawing of the part with all the dimensions? Or use the old part as a basis for the drawing. I'm sure there must be some machine shop that can fab them up?
Not saying that you can not find a shop to fab them up but it is not that simple. I own a machine shop and have just installed several pieces of new equipment and this is not something I would be looking at doing. There is more than machining here if you want to replicate the bonded or fused wear surface. Again; it can be done but good luck finding a shop with the means to produce them in extremely small quantities at an affordable price.
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