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My henna 84

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TBM
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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:44 am

Happened to make a visit to my fabricator today...

We looked at the condenser mounting that Ken has been talking about and Spent a few minutes discussing changes that would make sense for ease of mounting (read adjustability) and reach. Trying to make it easy to fab a "kit" for you guys that are interested.. Once the changes are made I will post again what was done and what the fabricator's cost for said kit. As I mentioned it will have to be made in enough numbers to lower the cost so that it's not a "prototypical" in price.


Hope this helps anyone interested.
'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Sun Jun 03, 2018 5:29 am

Little update...

Yet to do anything on the car lately.. Life is getting in the way (read: no spare time)...

BUT.. Did get the MK-60 abs unit. Took off the OEM piece and I need to fabricate all new lines as the Mk-60 unit requires a slight change in mounting height (one of the first reasons I switched to it in the first place as it make tins more room for a bigger plenum in the works).

In the pic below is the master cylinder and the NEW much narrower right hand drive reservoir(worked out beautifully as its dead on flush with the master on the right side, again more room for the plenum). And the "S" run of brake lines I will be removing and replacing with more direct lines from all four wheels..

Once I re-wire the Engine loom to the Emtron I'll be able to run traction control through this particular unit as its an early piece the BMW hadn't burned all the programing into for the E46 M3.. So its eprom is programable.

Also in anticipation I've already purchased a trigger and wheel for the cam position sensor a la S38B38
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'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:55 am

Hey there..

So for Father's day I worked on making progress on the car..

Extracted the full engine wire harness.. Marked it all up as a very knowledgeable fellow (Douglas) will be replicating it and making a new one for all the Emtron KV-8, new sensors, electric water pump, and ABS unit..
Speaking of the ABS unit.. I've tried to mock it up in the OEM location and it doesn't sit low enough in the bay to allow me to clear the size of plenum I am planning.. So I decided to ...GULP.. cut out the bracket (pressuring it in case I want to go back to OEM one day) and create a custom bracket that will look like a factory piece.
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'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:01 am

MK-60 ABS 1.JPG
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MK 60 ABS 2.JPG
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'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by ericono » Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:01 pm

Awesome stuff. Making good progress there. I have a few questions:

1) where did you get the Mk60 ABS parts? I have pondered doing the same thing. Are you swapping teeth rings and abs sensors at the hubs? Besides the wiring harness work, what else are you modifying to make this work?

2) Did you get the Spoon collars installed? Did you end up using them all?

3) Do you have a hand sketch or something that shows your electronic water pump routing? I am looking at a similar plan except using the e60 style ewp. Are you eliminating the e24 thermostat? Adding another one, or just using the controller to regulate the ewp and act as a thermostat?

Thanks and keep up the great work!

Eric
'85 M635, '00 528iT, '98 Z3

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:10 am

ericono wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:01 pm
Awesome stuff. Making good progress there. I have a few questions:

1) where did you get the Mk60 ABS parts? I have pondered doing the same thing. Are you swapping teeth rings and abs sensors at the hubs? Besides the wiring harness work, what else are you modifying to make this work?
I got the ABS unit through Doug.. He has more. I will be making tone disks. You can just work off of the ABS internal brain but you can also employ DSC (need the E46 streering collar and yaw sensor) and traction control via this unit if you run it through a good standalone

2) Did you get the Spoon collars installed? Did you end up using them all?
Not yet.. I'm planing a rack conversion so there's not reason to touch anything right now..Especially since I am waiting for the Group A uprights

3) Do you have a hand sketch or something that shows your electronic water pump routing? I am looking at a similar plan except using the e60 style ewp. Are you eliminating the e24 thermostat? Adding another one, or just using the controller to regulate the ewp and act as a thermostat?
Not really. No need for thermostat since the pump will run off of temp sensor and through standalone

Thanks and keep up the great work!
Thanks Eric!
Eric
'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Sat Jun 30, 2018 2:09 am

Since I was already in the area, I decided to clean the entire cowl area and remove the blower fan, clean it up and even a little in the ducts going in to the box (as much as I could). I know the shaft needs to be lubricated so I ordered some Bestline additive cause its the bomb!


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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Sat Jun 30, 2018 2:11 am

I also removed and cleaned the alarm horn, but to be honest, as I'm after losing weight I'm considering removing it since it works on the OEM DME and I wont use it any more... Any thoughts?
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'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:08 am

Well, its been a while and I've been trying to do a lot of planing because I plan to create a variable intake ITB's system a la similar to this"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xOPvIG ... icoDiSalvo

Ive been making a lot of room by condensing high pressure lines as you've seen in previous posts as well as using the brake reservoir from a right hand drive M635. I used some poster cardboard to make some templates off of measurements to get a sense of where I need to be. The one place I can tell you there is interference is the firewall area where the notorious heater valve sits.. I always like to find elegant reversible solutions and will continue to do so in this case. I will probably switch over to a more compact E46 valve and relocate it lower, which will cause future R&R issues for sure😳, but I will try to think like a manufacturer and take my time. I wont make any holes in the fire wall I am going to try and use whats available.
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Last edited by TBM on Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:09 am

I am planing to relocate the dip stick to an area between the first and second intake runners. I hope I can find someone to make a new tube that I will bend up...

and finally I am planing on making an exact model of the OEM airbox so that I can use the OEM sized ITG filter, except I will make the opening to the headlights much larger but shaped like to opening behind them for more air intake as well as a much much larger feed to the plenum because I plan to run a MAP/TPS (Variohm)/Dual Lambda system.
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Re: My henna 84

Post by GazM3 » Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:46 am

Looks ambitious and interesting. So variable trumpet length not variable plenum volume.

What are u going to use for an ecu?
BMW’s
74 2002 2.3ltr
84 E24 M635csi
94 E34 540i/6 SC
97 E36 M3 euro SC U/C

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Fri Aug 03, 2018 6:21 am

GazM3 wrote:
Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:46 am
Looks ambitious and interesting. So variable trumpet length not variable plenum volume.

What are u going to use for an ecu?
Plenum volume is basically the same but I think much more involved. I have access to a sophisticated 3D printer and hoping that some of my connections will help me figure out the mechanisms. The control is very easy..In fact an E46 M3 throttle motor can do the trick and be totally controlled by the standalone
One must figure out:
Bore
Stroke
Compression ratio
INtake valve size (and 2V or 4V chamber)
Target RPM at peak power
Target RPM at peak torque for shortest runner scenario (usually 1500 +/- 250 or so RPM lower than peak power RPM)
Target RPM for peak torque in longest runner scenario
I'm limited to about 179mm total space from butterfly and therefore movement maybe limited to about 88mm in total.. But still significant when tuning.

Emtron KV-8. Already purchased
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'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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layout planing

Post by TBM » Sun Aug 05, 2018 3:29 pm

A graphic showing some changes implemented and future of plenum. It wont be easy for sure, but I've spent a lot of time to try to keep everything looking oem in a sense by using as many OEM parts as possible on the peripherals. The size of the plenum is important but also the resonance as it relates to the pulses created but the motor. Its all in the details but in this case complicated ones. Just to give an idea of the complexity, there is a book that was written about plenum and intake design that is 500 pages long and costs almost $300...
As I'm having the engine torn down and rebuilt we are also considering Rod ratio, making custom cams and looking at exhaust design as it pertains to scavenging. Its the sum of all the parts and quite tedious and make work in unison without overspending.

future layout reference.jpg
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Re: My henna 84

Post by Jono B good » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:06 pm

Very cool, but my question is why do this? Our cars are becoming more and more rare everyday, why not leave it stock? As to retain its' resale values. And retain BMW's rich history. I feel honored to drive a historical car. Just my curious monkey mind asks WHY? ](*,)
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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:30 pm

Jono B good wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:06 pm
Very cool, but my question is why do this? Our cars are becoming more and more rare everyday, why not leave it stock? As to retain its' resale values. And retain BMW's rich history. I feel honored to drive a historical car. Just my curious monkey mind asks WHY? ](*,)
Sure resale value is good.. But after all I'm not doing anything that isn't reversible. And I bought the car to drive and enjoy. So if I'm spending so much money on BMW parts why not get more out of it as I see fit? The goal is more usable power throughout the rev range..and its a challenge.
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'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by GazM3 » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:19 am

This direction sounds exciting. I been collecting parts to eventually do my built engine. I’m even thinking using 13.5:1 comp with flex fuel e85 and pump fuel combined with water/meth port injection (all hidden under trumpets). I’m using another s38 with either 86mm or 90mm crank, as keeping the original engine as this will retain value if prices go into the stratosphere with our m635csi cars in the future.


The benifit of using high comp is u can use pretty agressive cams with a wider rev range. Should easily be able to make 450+bhp without having the engine too grumpy.
BMW’s
74 2002 2.3ltr
84 E24 M635csi
94 E34 540i/6 SC
97 E36 M3 euro SC U/C

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08 Holden Ute 6.0
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Urethane Foam plenum

Post by TBM » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:02 am

Well, I ordered the foam and made the plunge so to speak...

I first tried to mix 2oz+2oz =4oz mix. As you can see in the pics. It yielded +/- 62oz by volume.. So quick math tells me how much to mix AND.. not really. Had to mix 4 batches to complete the plenum. :D
It wasn't too bad but I hate sticky messes.

When it all cures I'll peel the outside and start carving her up. Hopefully it all came out ok. Otherwise I'l give it another try.
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'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Re: My henna 84

Post by GazM3 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:02 pm

Expandable foam is horrible stuff but souls make a good mould for the plenum construction. Fibreglass is not much better either
BMW’s
74 2002 2.3ltr
84 E24 M635csi
94 E34 540i/6 SC
97 E36 M3 euro SC U/C

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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:40 am

The first one didn't go as planned.. I had to use an orbital sander in order to "peel" the layer of poster board off.. :D
Well, I am excited to get things done so I've devised a more cunning plan and made a box from leftover OSB (stinky crap, I don't know how people would ever build their homes from it!) Also used wax paper this time for ease of de-molding

See Pics below ladies and gents:
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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:41 am

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Group A

Post by TBM » Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:36 am

I finally got these in!!!
I found a person that makes CNC aluminum versions (weigh the same as the original Magnesium cast pieces ) of the original Group A front suspension pieces. I always wanted them. Made in England
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Re: My henna 84

Post by TBM » Sat Sep 01, 2018 6:57 am

Hi All,

We have been fast at work on the intakes. The first thing we are doing is making sure that the back plate will fit the ITB's perfectly and so a mock up of the openings needed to be done. I am posting a link to the video showing the piece being made. Also, I think we figured out how to collapse the Velocity Stacks and lift them at the higher RPM like the Yamaha YCCI system does. The biggest hurdle is the plenum and supplying enough air to make it all breath as it should. After reading a lot of tech articles about resonance waves and inertial waves I can tell you that it isn't easy to get it all right.

video link:
https://youtu.be/ggMYA2QBvlA
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'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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Intakes

Post by TBM » Sun Oct 21, 2018 7:38 pm

Fast at work on the variable intake runners. They have been designed and are in the process of being finished on the 3d printer in Nylon X.
Collapsed Stacks.jpeg
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These will sit atop an aluminum back plate who's holes will have trumpet rings extending past the holes.. The design is so that the whole assembly can lift off and shorten the velocity stack at high RPM.

Like this
Lifted.jpeg
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Re: Group A

Post by Shipper 01 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:37 am

TBM wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:36 am
I finally got these in!!!
I found a person that makes CNC aluminum versions (weigh the same as the original Magnesium cast pieces ) of the original Group A front suspension pieces. I always wanted them. Made in England

Frint with stub axels.JPG
back .JPG
bottom.JPG
Supplier info available? I'd be interested in a set as well.

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Re: Group A

Post by TBM » Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:36 am

Shipper 01 wrote:
Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:37 am
TBM wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:36 am
I finally got these in!!!
I found a person that makes CNC aluminum versions (weigh the same as the original Magnesium cast pieces ) of the original Group A front suspension pieces. I always wanted them. Made in England

Frint with stub axels.JPG
back .JPG
bottom.JPG
Supplier info available? I'd be interested in a set as well.
HI,

Hit me up by PM..
'84 M635csi
'86 Lotus esprit Turbo (sold)

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